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CBS - East Race prediction
« on: July 21, 2018, 09:14:18 AM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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Brief but pretty good assessment of the East.  I would have mentioned the Toronto coaching change as a variable.  I also wonder about Lowry's performance decline last season.  Will he bounce back or is father time catching up to him? 

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/kawhi-leonard-demar-derozan-trade-where-the-raptors-rank-in-easts-new-hierarchy-after-blockbuster-deal/

Re: CBS - East Race prediction
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2018, 09:21:44 AM »

Offline greece66

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Good post tazz.


Overall a good assessment of where the balance stands in the East.


If I can make an early prediction, I have Detroit as a team that could make a surprise and move up a few spots from 8th seed.


They have a good coach and some good players, but obviously the X factor is Griffin. I expect him to bounce back.

Re: CBS - East Race prediction
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2018, 09:37:41 AM »

Offline Moranis

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I have Milwaukee and Washington flipped (though basically the same record) otherwise he has projected the East exactly like I see it playing out. 
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Re: CBS - East Race prediction
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2018, 09:40:41 AM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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Good post tazz.


Overall a good assessment of where the balance stands in the East.


If I can make an early prediction, I have Detroit as a team that could make a surprise and move up a few spots from 8th seed.


They have a good coach and some good players, but obviously the X factor is Griffin. I expect him to bounce back.
I'd forgotten they got rid of SVG.  If I were a Pistons fan, I'd be a bit optimistic but I'd expect Griffin to underperform his contract. 

Re: CBS - East Race prediction
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2018, 09:46:55 AM »

Offline blackbird

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In the 76ers section he writes that they have 2 of the top 5 players in the East:
1. Kawhi
2. Giannis
3. Embiid
4. Kyrie
5. Simmons

I'm mystified how anyone could consider Simmons a top 5 player. Off the top of my head (I'm sure I'm forgetting others) I can't rate him better than Wall, Porzingis, Beal, Lowry, Oladipo, Griffin, Horford, Hayward... or even Brown and Tatum! Yeah, I'm a homer but I don't have him as top 5 on the Celtics never mind the entire conference!!!

Re: CBS - East Race prediction
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2018, 09:52:21 AM »

Offline gouki88

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In the 76ers section he writes that they have 2 of the top 5 players in the East:
1. Kawhi
2. Giannis
3. Embiid
4. Kyrie
5. Simmons

I'm mystified how anyone could consider Simmons a top 5 player. Off the top of my head (I'm sure I'm forgetting others) I can't rate him better than Wall, Porzingis, Beal, Lowry, Oladipo, Griffin, Horford, Hayward... or even Brown and Tatum! Yeah, I'm a homer but I don't have him as top 5 on the Celtics never mind the entire conference!!!
Absolutely mystifying how anyone can consider him ahead of the guys you listed, plus borderline guys like Drummond and Kemba. He's so hilariously overrated.
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Re: CBS - East Race prediction
« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2018, 10:22:56 AM »

Offline saltlover

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In the 76ers section he writes that they have 2 of the top 5 players in the East:
1. Kawhi
2. Giannis
3. Embiid
4. Kyrie
5. Simmons

I'm mystified how anyone could consider Simmons a top 5 player. Off the top of my head (I'm sure I'm forgetting others) I can't rate him better than Wall, Porzingis, Beal, Lowry, Oladipo, Griffin, Horford, Hayward... or even Brown and Tatum! Yeah, I'm a homer but I don't have him as top 5 on the Celtics never mind the entire conference!!!
Absolutely mystifying how anyone can consider him ahead of the guys you listed, plus borderline guys like Drummond and Kemba. He's so hilariously overrated.

Oh, I think he’s a little overrated, and Victor Oladipo and Kemba Walker in particular are getting slighted by that ranking.  But by some measurements, Simmons had a more valuable season than all but Giannis on that list of 5 last season.  This is largely due to playing time (Kyrie and Embiid had better per 100 numbers by those same measurements, and Kawhi obviously didn’t play much), but playing 2700 minutes at a high level has its own value.

In my book it’s Kawhi and Giannis as a tier by themselves, and then about 5-8 players behind them that you could make arguments about, and Simmons is in that group, as is Embiid.  (So are Kyrie and Horford, of course.  Hayward will be if he returns like nothing happened, but his inclusion is an argument best had in January.)

Re: CBS - East Race prediction
« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2018, 10:43:01 AM »

Offline Moranis

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In the 76ers section he writes that they have 2 of the top 5 players in the East:
1. Kawhi
2. Giannis
3. Embiid
4. Kyrie
5. Simmons

I'm mystified how anyone could consider Simmons a top 5 player. Off the top of my head (I'm sure I'm forgetting others) I can't rate him better than Wall, Porzingis, Beal, Lowry, Oladipo, Griffin, Horford, Hayward... or even Brown and Tatum! Yeah, I'm a homer but I don't have him as top 5 on the Celtics never mind the entire conference!!!
Absolutely mystifying how anyone can consider him ahead of the guys you listed, plus borderline guys like Drummond and Kemba. He's so hilariously overrated.

Oh, I think he’s a little overrated, and Victor Oladipo and Kemba Walker in particular are getting slighted by that ranking.  But by some measurements, Simmons had a more valuable season than all but Giannis on that list of 5 last season.  This is largely due to playing time (Kyrie and Embiid had better per 100 numbers by those same measurements, and Kawhi obviously didn’t play much), but playing 2700 minutes at a high level has its own value.

In my book it’s Kawhi and Giannis as a tier by themselves, and then about 5-8 players behind them that you could make arguments about, and Simmons is in that group, as is Embiid.  (So are Kyrie and Horford, of course.  Hayward will be if he returns like nothing happened, but his inclusion is an argument best had in January.)
Yep and then you have to consider he was a rookie and you would expect him to progress far more than anyone else on that list except maybe Embiid.  If you are looking at next year, which this is, I think it is certainly not crazy to have Simmons in the top 5. 
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Re: CBS - East Race prediction
« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2018, 11:54:24 AM »

Offline blackbird

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In the 76ers section he writes that they have 2 of the top 5 players in the East:
1. Kawhi
2. Giannis
3. Embiid
4. Kyrie
5. Simmons

I'm mystified how anyone could consider Simmons a top 5 player. Off the top of my head (I'm sure I'm forgetting others) I can't rate him better than Wall, Porzingis, Beal, Lowry, Oladipo, Griffin, Horford, Hayward... or even Brown and Tatum! Yeah, I'm a homer but I don't have him as top 5 on the Celtics never mind the entire conference!!!
Absolutely mystifying how anyone can consider him ahead of the guys you listed, plus borderline guys like Drummond and Kemba. He's so hilariously overrated.

Oh, I think he’s a little overrated, and Victor Oladipo and Kemba Walker in particular are getting slighted by that ranking.  But by some measurements, Simmons had a more valuable season than all but Giannis on that list of 5 last season.  This is largely due to playing time (Kyrie and Embiid had better per 100 numbers by those same measurements, and Kawhi obviously didn’t play much), but playing 2700 minutes at a high level has its own value.

In my book it’s Kawhi and Giannis as a tier by themselves, and then about 5-8 players behind them that you could make arguments about, and Simmons is in that group, as is Embiid.  (So are Kyrie and Horford, of course.  Hayward will be if he returns like nothing happened, but his inclusion is an argument best had in January.)

If you're questioning Hayward -or at least reserving judgment- then don't you have to do the same for Kawhi?

And regardless there's no way I would put Simmons in the top ten right now. I mean, he's got the potential to be the #1 player but he's not there yet.