Author Topic: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?  (Read 7075 times)

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What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« on: July 21, 2019, 01:19:42 AM »

Offline Ogaju

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A lot is being thrown around about tampering and the Lakers feelings being hurt that Kawhi took them for a ride. It is always amazing how Jerry West AKA the logo always seems to skate when he tampers with other team's players.  West has a history of tampering the best example being the Shaq heist from Orlando. He also seemed to get Gasol for peanuts from the Grizzlies. Dont know how he came in and scooped KD from OKC. The most recent signing of Kawhi suggests that West may have been up to his old tricks again. It is quite probable that West and Kawhi had hatched a plan to get him to the Clippers long before Kawhi became a free agent. Lets review:

West traded Chris Paul, traded Tobias Harris, and traded Blake Griffin. He was left without a superstar on his team. That is not typical of West. In the early days of free agency 2019 Kawhi the price of the class narrowed teams to Lakers, Clippers, and Toronto. Lakers already had two stars therefore for them Kawhi would have been the icing on the cake. Toronto really had nowhere to go but to wait on Kawhi. It was curious that the Clippers without any stars on their roster would just wait while the stars in the class signed with other teams and not make any moves. It was weird that the Clippers put ALL their eggs in the Kawhi basket. That did not make any sense unless they already knew Kawhi and George were in the bag. Think about it this way, if the Clippers did not get Kawhi who was left on the market? The answer is NOBODY. Jerry West had Kawhi way before free agency, the rest of the play was a devious attempt to weaken the Lakers their main competitors with whom they share an arena. The Lakers are castigating Kawhi for playing them, but deep down they must know they were played by West, the same guy who notoriously laughed at the Lakers for trading them Zubac. Looks like Jerry takes joy in the Lakers inept front office. So what did Jerry West know? He knew Kawhi was going to be a Clipper. When did he know it? Probably around the same time he shipped off Tobias Harris to the sixers.

Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2019, 07:24:12 AM »

Offline moiso

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West is master GM but he's just a consultant now.  He claims not to have had much to do with getting Kawhi.  Who knows how much he is currently involved but I don't think we can say that West is responsible for all of those moves.

Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2019, 08:36:05 AM »

Online BitterJim

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It seems way more likely that West/Frank didn't think any of the other available players were worth ruining their chance for Kawhi. It takes a poorly run franchise (like the Knicks) to decide that players on the Tobias Harris or Julius Randle tiers are worth giving up a chance for a superstar like Kawhi

So I think they knew as much as we did (up until Kawhi told them that if they got Paul George he would sign with them). They knew that Kawhi wanted to play in LA, and did what they had to to be in a position to get him. They didn't know in advance that he was gonna sign there (it seems like Kawhi didn't, either), but they knew the possibility was there and left themselves open to it.

Trading Chris Paul was because he was about to leave in FA, tradong Blake was because the team wasn't going anywhere with him, and Harris was to get something out of him, because they weren't gonna give him the contract Philly just did. Opening up space to potentially get Kawhi may have been a factor in trading Harris, but it was far from the main/only reason
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Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2019, 09:43:23 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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TP ...for West's devious plans to weaken the Lakers !  :)

Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2019, 10:25:52 AM »

Offline bopna

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The Logo has some voodoo spell or something, everything he wanted he gets since his GM days as a Fker then to the Grizz which yup he didnt got them a championship but his GMdays there are perhaps their best years since they got to the WCF no less...now they are a sh!t hole again.....

On to GS and not just transformed them to a contender, a team that was a perenial Playoff boobooo to a freakin Dynasty picking up the ultimate heist in KD in FA in 2016 when the guy was ready to done a Celtic jersy..no West just gets his voodoo chain out and a last minute phonecall to KD and he was hooked.

Fast forward to this yr's FA bonanza where the prize was Kawhi and again West orchestrated his voodoo gem by not just picking up Kawhi but gotPG as well when he wasn't even a freakin FA....how on earth did he orchestrate that and manage to convince Presti to give him PG for a boatload of picks when Presti does not have to really give in yet...why didn't Presti wait out when he has PG on contract for several more yrs......simple, its Voodoo man.

The guy is like the godfather of GMs. what he says and all theother GMs just fold...he will give the Clippers their first championship iLL tell ya all...and there is nothing GM Lebron could do.

Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2019, 10:32:11 AM »

Offline hpantazo

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I said it before free agency, never count out the logo! The Clippers were my pick for landing Kawhi fully based on the influence of Jerry West. He gets things done.

Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2019, 10:41:19 AM »

Offline KGs Knee

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Quote
why didn't Presti wait out when he has PG on contract for several more yrs......simple, its Voodoo man.

Presti didn't wait for a better offer because there was practically zero chance he would ever get a better offer than the ridiculous overpay the Clippers offered.  The chance of Presti finding another team in such a unique situation that they could justify paying that much for George is almost nil.

West gets way more credit than he deserves here.  Kawhi had his mind set on LA all along.  All West had to do was offer Kawhi an alternative to joining LeBron.  West is fortunate Kawhi was able to convince George to demand a trade.  Had George not agreed Kawhi would be a Laker right now.

Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2019, 11:03:07 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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From reporting, everything that happened with Kawhi appeared to happen after June 30th at 6:00PM EST. The Kawhi signing and trade was not announced at 6 on the 30th. It took many days for everything to go down and little appeared to happen prior to the opening of free agency.

Durant also took meetings over several days after free agency opened before deciding on the Warriors. The Laker trade to obtain Gasol took place mid season.

I am not seeing some pattern of tampering. I just see some very high level of transactions being closed within the time frames they were supposed to happen.

Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2019, 11:07:40 AM »

Online Moranis

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This whole thread is based on the weird premise that Paul George would not only ask to be traded, not only that the Thunder would actually trade him, but also that the Thunder would be willing to trade him to LA.  That just seems highly unlikely.
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Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #9 on: July 21, 2019, 12:11:28 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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This whole thread is based on the weird premise that Paul George would not only ask to be traded, not only that the Thunder would actually trade him, but also that the Thunder would be willing to trade him to LA.  That just seems highly unlikely.

Highly unlikely seems to always happen with Jerry West. I gave all the examples where Jerry West has completed highly unlikely deals that made everyone go WOW at the time. In my opinion he had to have known something to just wait and wait .... he did not go after Butler, he did not go after Kemba, he did not go after Durant, or Klay Thompson. He could have got  tried any of those players and offered them as enticement for Kawhi. He did not do any of that. Where would the Clippers be if Kawhi did not sign? I just believe, just my opinion. that the delay was to ensure the Lakers did not get that third star. Of course Kawhi would play along why would he want to be with the Clippers if the Lakers had a big three. I dont believe Kawhi was ever going to be a third wheel with the Lakers. That is what he would have been with the Lakers a third wheel. He would have been the last piece. He did not want that. He would have been a competing wing against LeBron because AD is a big and doesnt have to worry about that. Most importantly he would be under the huge shadow of LeBron James. 

It could have been Kawhi's plan to sign with the Lakers when he left San Antonio, but once LeBron  moved to the Lakers they lost their chance to get Kawhi. LeBron James 'stole' Kawhi's position with the Lakers. The questions Kawhi asked Magic were centered around how much the Lakers want him, who is actually in control of the Lakers, and would he get the same extra benefits LeBron got with the Lakers. Jerry West and Kawhi had the same goal get back at the Lakers in Jerry's case for forcing him out and in Kawhi's case for not waiting one year for him. Once he settled on the Clippers the only thing left was to make sure to stop the Laker Juggernaut. Jerry West knows these players, he knows their needs and how to talk to them.

Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #10 on: July 21, 2019, 12:14:54 PM »

Offline Jiri Welsch

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It seems so crazy that LAL could complain about Kawhi’s behavior when they basically just tried to strong-arm the Pelicans into trading AD to them before the deadline. 

Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2019, 12:28:43 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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This whole thread is based on the weird premise that Paul George would not only ask to be traded, not only that the Thunder would actually trade him, but also that the Thunder would be willing to trade him to LA.  That just seems highly unlikely.

Highly unlikely seems to always happen with Jerry West. I gave all the examples where Jerry West has completed highly unlikely deals that made everyone go WOW at the time. In my opinion he had to have known something to just wait and wait .... he did not go after Butler, he did not go after Kemba, he did not go after Durant, or Klay Thompson. He could have got  tried any of those players and offered them as enticement for Kawhi. He did not do any of that. Where would the Clippers be if Kawhi did not sign? I just believe, just my opinion. that the delay was to ensure the Lakers did not get that third star. Of course Kawhi would play along why would he want to be with the Clippers if the Lakers had a big three. I dont believe Kawhi was ever going to be a third wheel with the Lakers. That is what he would have been with the Lakers a third wheel. He would have been the last piece. He did not want that. He would have been a competing wing against LeBron because AD is a big and doesnt have to worry about that. Most importantly he would be under the huge shadow of LeBron James. 

It could have been Kawhi's plan to sign with the Lakers when he left San Antonio, but once LeBron  moved to the Lakers they lost their chance to get Kawhi. LeBron James 'stole' Kawhi's position with the Lakers. The questions Kawhi asked Magic were centered around how much the Lakers want him, who is actually in control of the Lakers, and would he get the same extra benefits LeBron got with the Lakers. Jerry West and Kawhi had the same goal get back at the Lakers in Jerry's case for forcing him out and in Kawhi's case for not waiting one year for him. Once he settled on the Clippers the only thing left was to make sure to stop the Laker Juggernaut. Jerry West knows these players, he knows their needs and how to talk to them.

This is wholly inaccurate.

Kawhi tried to persuade both Durant and Kyrie to the Clippers with him.  They both were flattered but had already agreed to team up with each other.  Kemba appears to simply be an east coast guy and was far more intrigued by either NY or Boston (or even Charlotte).  I'm not really sure what happened with Jimmy, but the Sixers would have had to be willing to play ball and the Clippers would have needed to find a third team to facilitate a deal.  It would have been complicated.  I also think Jimmy didn't want to wait and lose out on the opportunity to go to Miami.  But like I said, I'm not entirely sure about Jimmy, there wasn't as much reporting about him once he decided Miami early on.  Klay was always going to stay with GSW.

So in reality, the Clippers couldn't have just gotten any of those guys.  It seems they actually couldn't get any of them.

Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2019, 12:36:55 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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It seems so crazy that LAL could complain about Kawhi’s behavior when they basically just tried to strong-arm the Pelicans into trading AD to them before the deadline.


typical .....Plan A every year .....strong arm the best player of the T wolfs , Pelicans , Griz or Magic .....let them draft the best players ...the. fix it so they all decide to move to warm wonderful LA .  I knew they would never build a team with a real coach and draft .  They cater to the Kyries and Brons of the world ...now Davis too

Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2019, 12:41:58 PM »

Offline Birdman

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Jerry West is one of best ever...everyone knows him and respect him so when he talk, ppl listen
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Re: What did Jerry West know and when did he know it?
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2019, 12:56:48 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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This whole thread is based on the weird premise that Paul George would not only ask to be traded, not only that the Thunder would actually trade him, but also that the Thunder would be willing to trade him to LA.  That just seems highly unlikely.

Highly unlikely seems to always happen with Jerry West. I gave all the examples where Jerry West has completed highly unlikely deals that made everyone go WOW at the time. In my opinion he had to have known something to just wait and wait .... he did not go after Butler, he did not go after Kemba, he did not go after Durant, or Klay Thompson. He could have got  tried any of those players and offered them as enticement for Kawhi. He did not do any of that. Where would the Clippers be if Kawhi did not sign? I just believe, just my opinion. that the delay was to ensure the Lakers did not get that third star. Of course Kawhi would play along why would he want to be with the Clippers if the Lakers had a big three. I dont believe Kawhi was ever going to be a third wheel with the Lakers. That is what he would have been with the Lakers a third wheel. He would have been the last piece. He did not want that. He would have been a competing wing against LeBron because AD is a big and doesnt have to worry about that. Most importantly he would be under the huge shadow of LeBron James. 

It could have been Kawhi's plan to sign with the Lakers when he left San Antonio, but once LeBron  moved to the Lakers they lost their chance to get Kawhi. LeBron James 'stole' Kawhi's position with the Lakers. The questions Kawhi asked Magic were centered around how much the Lakers want him, who is actually in control of the Lakers, and would he get the same extra benefits LeBron got with the Lakers. Jerry West and Kawhi had the same goal get back at the Lakers in Jerry's case for forcing him out and in Kawhi's case for not waiting one year for him. Once he settled on the Clippers the only thing left was to make sure to stop the Laker Juggernaut. Jerry West knows these players, he knows their needs and how to talk to them.

This is wholly inaccurate.

Kawhi tried to persuade both Durant and Kyrie to the Clippers with him.  They both were flattered but had already agreed to team up with each other.  Kemba appears to simply be an east coast guy and was far more intrigued by either NY or Boston (or even Charlotte).  I'm not really sure what happened with Jimmy, but the Sixers would have had to be willing to play ball and the Clippers would have needed to find a third team to facilitate a deal.  It would have been complicated.  I also think Jimmy didn't want to wait and lose out on the opportunity to go to Miami.  But like I said, I'm not entirely sure about Jimmy, there wasn't as much reporting about him once he decided Miami early on.  Klay was always going to stay with GSW.

So in reality, the Clippers couldn't have just gotten any of those guys.  It seems they actually couldn't get any of them.

you grossly underestimate Jerry West. By the way if the choice is between Clippers tampering with PG before FA and Clippers tampering with PG after free agency, I think it is a distinction without a difference.