Author Topic: Lost (TV Show)  (Read 45042 times)

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Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #135 on: May 26, 2010, 02:36:43 PM »

Offline LarBrd33

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it was hack writing.  The lost writers copped out and razzledazzled everyone with some religious nonsense.  This article sums up why it was hack storytelling: http://hotair.com/greenroom/archives/2010/05/25/the-betrayal-of-mystery/

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #136 on: May 26, 2010, 03:03:06 PM »

Offline LB3533

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I think the writers needed a way to explain the "flash sideways" story line from Season 6.

Real purgatory is more along the lines of where Michael is on the Island just whispering in the jungle.

The "Flash Sideways" represented a reality more like that of the "Matrix" where people were "alive", but really "asleep".

I feel like the writers really came up empty on the story lines and story telling at the end of Season 5, so that's why they came up with the "Flash Sideways" arc.

But because they introduced this new element it added another aspect that needed explaining to go along with the other mysteries of the Island and Jacob/MiB Smokey etc. that all needed explaining.

What was so great about Lost and its earlier seasons were the characters and the use of the flashbacks to explain or enlighten the viewers about these characters' back story. These two elements were very much in sync and utilized very well on the early going.

"Lost" lost some of its original essence when the writers introduced the "Flash Forwards" & "Flash Sideways". But it did give the writers new room to work with, at the same time, new questions to answer.


Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #137 on: May 26, 2010, 03:22:32 PM »

Offline Brendan

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I liked it.

The only standard is that the rules of the universe within Lost (once accepted) are played by. I don't think they broke those rules.

The island itself is two things:
1. The spiritual element - the light, the temple pool, etc.
2. The scientific element - the E/M

Both sides are valid - the root of the light may indeed by spiritual, but the manifestations are indeed physical. It's why Daniel Farrady could understand so much about the island, even though he couldn't comprehend it's spiritual side. And it's why even those who embraced the spiritual side (let's say Locke) - couldn't really understand the island. Not even Jacob fully understood the island - he didn't know how to kill MIB, and he didn't know certain things his "mother" did, like how to make it so MIB and Jacob couldn't kill each other, etc. Being the "Jacob" was also no recipe for being a better person. He still "killed" MIB by throwing him into the light - "would I die? no - something worse than Death." Remember that his mother thanks MIB when she is killed, and also apologizes before killing their real mom. At the same time - she is flawed... killed the real mom, kills the villagers, thinks everyone is bad, won't let MIB leave. I think MIB could have left up until he became smoke monster.

Dharma was a bunch of scientists - they were trying to exploit the island resources - but they didn't know that much about the island.

The others are just people that had been brought to the island (either by Ben), from Dharma (like Ethan), by chance (like Alex), and probably by Jacob. The island seemed to slow aging so it makes sense that the group would grow overtime - and a band of others already existed when Dharma was there. Pregnancies turned out fine until some time between the nuke set off by Juliet and sometime well before they get Juliet. I'd go with the nerve gas murder as leaving some toxins behind that cause the problem, but the nuke could have done it too.

Generally the mystery of the island is greater than the show - we don't know who did all the carvings, built the temple, put the stone in the fountain in the cave, built the tunnels and special stuff under the others, etc.

In terms of the ending - I don't think you need to over think it. By the end of the show, those main set of characters had been redeemed, but were not necessarily ready to move on. They still had some issues that had to be resolved and the sideways flash presented a real challenge, it made them superficially happy. Jack is a father, on good terms with his own father's flaws, working hard and liking work, on good terms with his ex. You could say superficially these are the things he'd want, or reflect what he believes about himself to make himself happy. (Almost like the Tom Cruise and Penelope Cruz movie where he has a comfortable existence in virtual reality and can wake up if he does something he chose as the exit.)

The sideways flash is like the opposite of Micheal's existence, where he's trapped as a ghost in the real world. The "redeemed" are trapped as real people in a fake world. But just like the Ghosts can sometimes make contact with the real world - through Hugo for instance, Desmond is still able to flash to the sideways world. Desmond essentially accelerates their exit by bringing the people together, eventually Hugo might have met Libby. Etc.

The other thing the writers did is by making the sideways flash purgatory (of sorts) they put to rest the claim that the island is purgatory.

Was it perfect? No. There were probably about 25-30% too many episodes, but the writers didn't know which way to go at times, as much as the audience is moving with the story, so are the writers. Could we have done without the temple subplot? Probably. Etc.

One other observation - Sayid leaves Locke and redeems himself, even though the temple guys said he was evil and become more evil. What's the answer here? Free will triumphs "destiny".
« Last Edit: May 26, 2010, 04:01:03 PM by Brendan »

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #138 on: May 26, 2010, 03:36:54 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #139 on: May 26, 2010, 03:41:56 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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Here's the way I interpreted the finale.

After they revealed that the alternate reality was in fact, purgatory and that they were all dead and that they way people move on out of purgatory was together they then showed the light, Jack's eye closed as he died on the island and credit's rolled. But then after they started rolling the credits they went back and showed the island where the original plane crash occurred and and it appeared as if the crash had just occurred and there were no survivors.

So, were they actually alive while experiencing what they did on the island? I think that last scene was trying to tell us that the island was a place where people go to prove there worthiness to get to purgatory or it was a place people went that didn't accept they were dead. If in fact there were no survivors of Oceanic 815, then the island is mysterious and had special powers because it is a place in the afterlife constructed to make people still believe they are alive and can stay alive even under the most bizarre explanations which to them become believable.

One of the few things the finale was explicit about was that "everything that happened, happened" ie the Island was real, everyone was alive when they were there, etc.  I agree that the island was in many ways a test of the character of the people that came there, but they didn't die beforehand.

I think the last shot of the wreckage was just a throwback to the pilot, and shows that the plane wreck is now part of the "culture" of the island, like the Black Rock, Henry Gale's balloon, the crashed biplane, etc.  Plus if you look closely there are still footprints around the wreckage and some of the shelters the survivors built in the early days are there.  So I don't think everyone died in the crash.

There was a lot on the show that was shown and not told - like the significance of the Numbers (candidate #s on Jacob's cave wall, symbolized that the characters had been linked long before they ever met) or the origins of the pregnancy issues (never spelled out, but Jacob lives in the foot of a destroyed statue of the Egyptian goddess of fertility).  A lot of things were left hanging, but quite a few answers were at least strongly implied.  But since a character never turned to the camera and explicitly spelled them out, a lot of people think they were never addressed at all.

Going to go through the series again this summer with my girlfriend - my second time and her first for 95% of the series.  Should be interesting to see how things hold up now that I know how everything turns out.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2010, 03:46:57 PM by fairweatherfan »

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #140 on: May 26, 2010, 04:02:38 PM »

Offline Brendan

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I liked it.
Yeah, me too. A lot.
I updated my post to flush out my thoughts a bit.

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #141 on: May 26, 2010, 04:18:36 PM »

Offline Hoops

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I liked it.

The only standard is that the rules of the universe within Lost (once accepted) are played by. I don't think they broke those rules.

The island itself is two things:
1. The spiritual element - the light, the temple pool, etc.
2. The scientific element - the E/M

Both sides are valid - the root of the light may indeed by spiritual, but the manifestations are indeed physical. It's why Daniel Farrady could understand so much about the island, even though he couldn't comprehend it's spiritual side. And it's why even those who embraced the spiritual side (let's say Locke) - couldn't really understand the island. Not even Jacob fully understood the island - he didn't know how to kill MIB, and he didn't know certain things his "mother" did, like how to make it so MIB and Jacob couldn't kill each other, etc. Being the "Jacob" was also no recipe for being a better person. He still "killed" MIB by throwing him into the light - "would I die? no - something worse than Death." Remember that his mother thanks MIB when she is killed, and also apologizes before killing their real mom. At the same time - she is flawed... killed the real mom, kills the villagers, thinks everyone is bad, won't let MIB leave. I think MIB could have left up until he became smoke monster.

Dharma was a bunch of scientists - they were trying to exploit the island resources - but they didn't know that much about the island.

The others are just people that had been brought to the island (either by Ben), from Dharma (like Ethan), by chance (like Alex), and probably by Jacob. The island seemed to slow aging so it makes sense that the group would grow overtime - and a band of others already existed when Dharma was there. Pregnancies turned out fine until some time between the nuke set off by Juliet and sometime well before they get Juliet. I'd go with the nerve gas murder as leaving some toxins behind that cause the problem, but the nuke could have done it too.

Generally the mystery of the island is greater than the show - we don't know who did all the carvings, built the temple, put the stone in the fountain in the cave, built the tunnels and special stuff under the others, etc.

In terms of the ending - I don't think you need to over think it. By the end of the show, those main set of characters had been redeemed, but were not necessarily ready to move on. They still had some issues that had to be resolved and the sideways flash presented a real challenge, it made them superficially happy. Jack is a father, on good terms with his own father's flaws, working hard and liking work, on good terms with his ex. You could say superficially these are the things he'd want, or reflect what he believes about himself to make himself happy. (Almost like the Tom Cruise and Penelope Cruz movie where he has a comfortable existence in virtual reality and can wake up if he does something he chose as the exit.)

The sideways flash is like the opposite of Micheal's existence, where he's trapped as a ghost in the real world. The "redeemed" are trapped as real people in a fake world. But just like the Ghosts can sometimes make contact with the real world - through Hugo for instance, Desmond is still able to flash to the sideways world. Desmond essentially accelerates their exit by bringing the people together, eventually Hugo might have met Libby. Etc.

The other thing the writers did is by making the sideways flash purgatory (of sorts) they put to rest the claim that the island is purgatory.

Was it perfect? No. There were probably about 25-30% too many episodes, but the writers didn't know which way to go at times, as much as the audience is moving with the story, so are the writers. Could we have done without the temple subplot? Probably. Etc.

One other observation - Sayid leaves Locke and redeems himself, even though the temple guys said he was evil and become more evil. What's the answer here? Free will triumphs "destiny".

Amen to your thoughts. Not much else to add.

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #142 on: May 28, 2010, 11:03:21 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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Did anyone else heat that the last scene of the original crash site was not part of the broadcast the show put together, but a scene that ABC just threw in there at the end to soften the end? 

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #143 on: May 28, 2010, 11:20:15 AM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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Did anyone else heat that the last scene of the original crash site was not part of the broadcast the show put together, but a scene that ABC just threw in there at the end to soften the end? 

Yeah, I read about that - not surprised, the last shot of the actual show was always going to be Jack's eye closing.  Sure did confuse a lot of people though.

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #144 on: May 28, 2010, 11:26:55 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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Did anyone else heat that the last scene of the original crash site was not part of the broadcast the show put together, but a scene that ABC just threw in there at the end to soften the end? 

Yeah, I read about that - not surprised, the last shot of the actual show was always going to be Jack's eye closing.  Sure did confuse a lot of people though.


Sent many people into a complete melt down. 

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #145 on: May 28, 2010, 12:10:37 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Confused me that's for sure.

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #146 on: May 28, 2010, 02:27:52 PM »

Offline FallGuy

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With every passing day, I find this finale a bit worse than i did on first viewing.

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #147 on: May 31, 2010, 02:38:02 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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Saw this today, pretty funny:

SportCenter explaining Lost as if it were about the 2007 New England Patriots.

Looks like it was made before the finale, but it's a pretty good summary.

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #148 on: June 05, 2010, 08:38:02 AM »

Offline celticmaestro

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LOST made sense to me, it was awesome and I loved it. One day when I have time I will watch it all over again. I can't wait.

Re: Lost (TV Show)
« Reply #149 on: June 07, 2010, 12:13:00 AM »

Offline The Walker Wiggle

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