Bill Simmons on the Celtics off-season

[crownsy]

Does anyone know how much Ray Allen (who at least half the people here hate as a player) has left?  

  At least half the people here hate Ray Allen as a player? Seriously?

I think he's referring to all the trade speculation.

  But that was mainly based on the length of his contract.

I know but some people think that means you also don't like Ray as a player.

I still like Bill's column's, they're funny.

While I was reffering to all the trade suggestions (that started after last season) I was also reffering to all the complaints about him from the play-offs the last two seasons.  Except for the finals, everyone(that's an exaggeration) was crying for Rays head. 

Id go beyond exaggeration to outright misrembering.

Some people were disappointed with ray's slump in 2008, but i think most were pretty happy with his 2009 post season, what with him saving our season twice vs chicago and all.

[furball]

Does anyone know how much Ray Allen (who at least half the people here hate as a player) has left?  

 At least half the people here hate Ray Allen as a player? Seriously?

I think he's referring to all the trade speculation.

  But that was mainly based on the length of his contract.

I know but some people think that means you also don't like Ray as a player.

I still like Bill's column's, they're funny.

While I was reffering to all the trade suggestions (that started after last season) I was also reffering to all the complaints about him from the play-offs the last two seasons.  Except for the finals, everyone(that's an exaggeration) was crying for Rays head. 

Id go beyond exaggeration to outright misrembering.

Some people were disappointed with ray's slump in 2008, but i think most were pretty happy with his 2009 post season, what with him saving our season twice vs chicago and all.

I could go back and find all the posts hating on him but I don't really feel like it or care enough, besides, it has nothing to do with this topic. 

[Fafnir]

I could go back and find all the posts hating on him but I don't really feel like it or care enough, besides, it has nothing to do with this topic. 

Best argument ever! I could prove you all wrong but I'm too lazy to do so.

[paintitgreen]

Who do you think AI is better than on this list? Consider also that Tim Duncan, Kobe Bryant, LeBron James, and several other current players aren't on this list at all.

I don't think AI cracks top 50 myself.

Basically, I think AI is better than pretty much everybody I didn't mention in one of my two areas (the 27 I think are definitely better than him and the 15 or so I'd say he's in the argument with. I'd put AI around 35-40. Nash around 45-50. But I totally respect your opinion on things.

[ToppersBsktball10]

I was totally going to go with an article about how hated we'll be next year, especially if we get Bowen

I'll probably still run with the idea, but I hate that he printed it before me

Let the haters hate. They're just made they can't be us. 

[CelticG1]

I could go back and find all the posts hating on him but I don't really feel like it or care enough, besides, it has nothing to do with this topic. 

Best argument ever! I could prove you all wrong but I'm too lazy to do so.

Wow there were so many threads after the Orlando series complaining about ray and wanting to trade him. I remember specifically making the point about him saving us a few times in the chicago series and was told that he had one good game in that series. Here is the link to one of the many trade ray allen/hater threads. I had to respond to this because i remember getting so frustrated at the time... http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=28373.0 ...At one point someone says that Kirk heinrich is equal or better than ray allen

[crownsy]

I could go back and find all the posts hating on him but I don't really feel like it or care enough, besides, it has nothing to do with this topic. 

Best argument ever! I could prove you all wrong but I'm too lazy to do so.

Wow there were so many threads after the Orlando series complaining about ray and wanting to trade him. I remember specifically making the point about him saving us a few times in the chicago series and was told that he had one good game in that series. Here is the link to one of the many trade ray allen/hater threads. I had to respond to this because i remember getting so frustrated at the time... http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=28373.0 ...At one point someone says that Kirk heinrich is equal or better than ray allen

thats one person in a thread with a ton of posts, and even they weren't saying that ray allen sucks, just that if we got kirk back, it would lessen the loss of ray in the deal, and it's their opinion. This is also a trade thread, not a "GOD I HATE RAY ALLEN!@!@!@!@" thread as you attempt to initially classify it as.

its been said that their are quote "tons" of threads saying ray allen sucks as the main point of the post. if thats true, go find me one, not a weak trade thread you try to pass off as a "haters" thread due to soem posters saying we should look into trading ray while his value is high.

 Ray allen is a valuable expiring contract. HE gets brought up in trade threads because he's one of the few chips we have, not because people "hate" him.

also, with regards to hinrich, someone not having your world view or player eval is not "hating" its called disagreement. it's also not hating to point out that for the most part, our roster is entirely unattractive to other teams (see: pacers and not wanting anything on our roster for a S & T) and that ray allen is one of the only expiring contracts we have that has value.

[huzy]

I'm going to avoid the discussion about how many people on this blog hate Ray Allen.

In my brief time on Celticsblog, I've come to learn that asking "how do you feel about Ray Allen?" is the equivilent of  asking "are you a Democrat or Republican?"
Bringing him up is a can of worms that will highjack whatever discussion is taking place.

In regards to Simmons, my only criticism is that he didn't provide any alternatives in his assesment of the Celtics' offseason. Would he prefer that we signed Brandon Bass for the Mid Level? Ron Artest? Similar to many other Celtic fans, I think Simmons has fallen in love with "the ghost of James Posey."
It's not that simple.
Honestly, name me how many hybrid SG/SF Free Agents that can defend both positions effectively and spread the floor. We couldn't have afforded Ariza and because of the required urgency in signing Sheed, we didn't even know he was an option (I assume.) Anthony Parker? Grant Hill? Jamario Moon? We tried. Didn't happen...

Successful basketball is a complex formula. Simmons emphasizes this point by his criticism of Orlando abandoning their non conventional system and the importance of matchups. I won't ignore the fact that Pierce and Ray Allen both need their share of rest during the season, but the market drove the Celtics to Marquis Daniels as the best option. He doesn't fit the "Posey" mold that I think Simmons invisioned as the missing piece, but he will be a valuable asset to this team.

I personally thought that Daniels and Sheed would've commanded upwards of $14-$15 million combined before entering this offseason. We're going to have both for half the price. Also, I think it's fair to say that both could start for half of the franchises in the NBA.

If the offseason ends today...I'm not complaining. Midseason, I'll be suprised if Simmons doesn't agree. 

[snively]

Blech... Simmons has really gone downhill.  I didn't laugh once in a sitdown reading of both parts.  His "insider" status and ESPN-conferred legitimacy have made him an obnoxious pseudo analyst as opposed to a comedic fan with an occasional insight.

He now seems driven to have a unique and authoritative take on every NBA signing, which has led to a lot of wild but shallow hyperbole about every team as opposed to the zany but interesting homer/fan diaries he used to put together.

His analysis of the Sheed signing was terrible.  "For all we know, the Lakers and Celtics BOTH made themselves worse."  Really?  And Big Baby a "proven playoff banger?"  The same Baby who averaged 5.6 boards as PF/C in 36 minutes per game during the playoffs, while anchoring a non-existent interior defense when Perk was off the floor?

He's just spouting a lot of hasty gut judgments with the faux gravitas of a self-appointed expert.  You know, kind of like Steven A. Smith.

And Jeff, please don't despair that he "scooped" you with the most hated team comment.  Many, many posters came up with that idea as soon as the signing of Sheed went public.

[PosImpos]

Well, I must say that I watched Almost Famous as a result of reading Bill's latest, and I liked it a lot.  Is it the best film of this decade?  Nah.  Still good though.

[dlpin]

How appropriate. I think Bill's writing is exactly like almost famous:
if you go in expecting a master piece, you will be completely disappointed. If you go in with low expectations, just wanting to be entertained for a few hours and then completely forget about everything you saw a few days later, you will enjoy it.

[MaineBleedsGreen]

Mostly the size. I like it to defend 2s and handle the ball alongside House in the second unit. I don't like it to match up against 3s. I don't think he has the bulk to play there, even if he almost has the height - I'd prefer a 6'8" guy or an exceptionally strong 6'6"-6'7" guy. I also would rather have a guy who can help us go small by playing some minutes at the 4. Although with our three big men and potentially a fourth if we keep Davis, going small is not something we're going to do.

The fact is, the guys I really want a backup small forward to help with are Lebron and Rashard Lewis (likely switching to the 3). I don't think Daniels is even an adequate option on those guys (though I still like other things he brings here).

However, I hope that I am totally wrong and he's just fine at the 3.

I just got spoiled by Posey, whom I irrationally loved from day one.

I'm comfortable with Garnett covering whoever a team puts at the 4 "if they want to go small". He's completely capable, and will only have to play short minutes covering a small 4, in a small ball lineup, because it simply won't work against KG.

Though if you're talking about a bench player, Scals can fill in a bit, and even maybe bill walker this season. Though I'd love to see the Celtics figure out a way to get Warrick, and then he could be our athletic 3/4 that you seem to want.