What Danny is really doing and why we should stop jumping to conclusions

[kgainez]

I posted this idea in another thread, and the more info that comes out and the more I think about it, the more sense it makes.

1. Danny isn't tanking. He really can't at this point, in my opinion. Between ticket sales and the talent on this team, it's impossible. He's rebuilding the Celtic team from top to bottom. Instead of a team that focuses on two veterans to carry the team and a fairly slow pace, I think Danny has decided he wants to make this team younger. There are two reasons for this:

a. It's where the NBA is going. And I think it's ever so evident after the Spurs lost the championship. So close but so far, and the young(er) guys ended up winning.  Miami forced a game 7, that frankly shouldn't have happened, but the Spurs just ran out of gas. It's not 100% the reason (I also think in games 6 and 7 Pop just got outcoached), but it has to be unsettling, esp when your team is kind of set up the same way. The NBA is young, athletic and exciting now.

b. This is Rondo's team now. And, I believe, Rondo is admittedly a guy who likes a little bit of flash. He likes the fancy passes and the fake behind the back passes and the ooh's and the aah's. Rondo thinks he's the best PG in the league. When Rondo went out, I was tagged as anti-Rondo, but as the remainder of the season went out I realized that the 'ball pounding' and the idea that Rondo is ball-dominant seems to have come from the coaching. I think with younger guys that are athletic he'll have so much fun actually pushing the pace! And while many believe Rondo's assists will take a hit, I believe they'll actually be the same or better. Lots of lobs and wide open jumpers all day because of the way Rondo will push the ball and take advantage of defenses.

2. Danny isn't stupid and that's why the coach essentially doesn't matter for right now. Danny is going to make this Rondo's team. We already say Jackie Mac say they're gonna plaster his face everywhere. I also believe (this is speculation) that Rondo knows exactly whats going on and what's happened with Doc. Danny is essentially taking a chance on the youth movement and on Rondo. The idea is to get a cheap coach on a short contract to see if Rondo/Jeff/Sully and whomever can actually open some eyes and be competitive. If they essentially pass the test, DA will show some trust by going out and getting a better coach. And ideally, the team will have so much potential that a decent coach will be salivating to get here. If DA puts a guy like VDN on a contract longer than 2 years I will be thoroughly surprised.

3. We're still getting assets. I think the problem with most of us is we see one step. So we got that unprotected pick from LAC so we immediately go to see who may be available in the 2015 draft. I think not. Picks are like the cherry on top  of a good trade. It makes a contract that you don't necessarily like look better. We may not be able to trade Jet right out, but if we trade Jet and a first round unprotected pick, someone may be more willing to jump. However, I still do think DA is a draft god (Delonte, Rondo, Jeff, AB, Sully, etc.) and I think he'll get a wonderful pick if he does decide to use them. But I don't think he's using all of em (I'm assuming the Cavs for PP trade is true).

---------

This is all what I think and what makes sense to me. I don't think you keep a guy like Rondo, who's obviously going to want to play, in order to tank. I don't think you keep a guy like Jeff Green either. We get rid of PP, we have $15 mil off the books this year. We find something to do with KG that's $11 mil off the books. Get a long contract off the books and you'll have some more space.

DA is about to attempt to make Boston attractive. I see lots of ppl saying this is the end and that we're tanking, but I implore you to wait til AT LEAST the end of July. All we've done is gotten rid of our coach (who has a very similar first 5 years as VDN -- Doc didn't turn into a winner/"Great coach" until he got the big 3) -- so I'm just going to wait and see what happens.

I think others should too. And if I'm right, I'm extremely excited about all this.

[erisred]

I like optimism!

I think 2013 is going to be an exciting, fun, year, but with a rather large number of loses. Personally, I'm hoping for one re-tooling year, followed by a bounce back toward the top.

[aingeforthree]

I think you're spot on with #3.

Assets + Draft

Ainge has proven that with these 2 alone, you can change the outlook of the franchise. You don't need to tank. He did it by drafting the likes of Rajon Rondo, Tony Allen, & Kendrick Perkins and none were top 15 picks.  He compiled assets through the draft in Jefferson, & used a top draft pick to acquire Ray.

I think Ainge will use his same formula.  Hit in the draft with a couple picks here and there (Rondo, Allen, Perkins), then trade for veteran help using players/picks when need be (Jefferson package for KG, top 5 pick for Ray).  Sign the reasonable vets out there that can help win & complete the team(Posey).

This might be sooner rather than later because Ainge has a far better roster at his display than he did back in 2007. He just needs the assets now & Doc, Pierce, & KG might provide just that.

[kgainez]

I like optimism!

I think 2013 is going to be an exciting, fun, year, but with a rather large number of loses. Personally, I'm hoping for one re-tooling year, followed by a bounce back toward the top.

oh yea...i don't think we're going to win much either because it's going to be an entirely diff structure, but not because we suck. I don't think we go 24-58, but I'll be surprised if we have a winning season.

[eugen]

I posted this idea in another thread, and the more info that comes out and the more I think about it, the more sense it makes.

1. Danny isn't tanking. He really can't at this point, in my opinion. Between ticket sales and the talent on this team, it's impossible. He's rebuilding the Celtic team from top to bottom. Instead of a team that focuses on two veterans to carry the team and a fairly slow pace, I think Danny has decided he wants to make this team younger. There are two reasons for this:

a. It's where the NBA is going. And I think it's ever so evident after the Spurs lost the championship. So close but so far, and the young(er) guys ended up winning.  Miami forced a game 7, that frankly shouldn't have happened, but the Spurs just ran out of gas. It's not 100% the reason (I also think in games 6 and 7 Pop just got outcoached), but it has to be unsettling, esp when your team is kind of set up the same way. The NBA is young, athletic and exciting now.

b. This is Rondo's team now. And, I believe, Rondo is admittedly a guy who likes a little bit of flash. He likes the fancy passes and the fake behind the back passes and the ooh's and the aah's. Rondo thinks he's the best PG in the league. When Rondo went out, I was tagged as anti-Rondo, but as the remainder of the season went out I realized that the 'ball pounding' and the idea that Rondo is ball-dominant seems to have come from the coaching. I think with younger guys that are athletic he'll have so much fun actually pushing the pace! And while many believe Rondo's assists will take a hit, I believe they'll actually be the same or better. Lots of lobs and wide open jumpers all day because of the way Rondo will push the ball and take advantage of defenses.

2. Danny isn't stupid and that's why the coach essentially doesn't matter for right now. Danny is going to make this Rondo's team. We already say Jackie Mac say they're gonna plaster his face everywhere. I also believe (this is speculation) that Rondo knows exactly whats going on and what's happened with Doc. Danny is essentially taking a chance on the youth movement and on Rondo. The idea is to get a cheap coach on a short contract to see if Rondo/Jeff/Sully and whomever can actually open some eyes and be competitive. If they essentially pass the test, DA will show some trust by going out and getting a better coach. And ideally, the team will have so much potential that a decent coach will be salivating to get here. If DA puts a guy like VDN on a contract longer than 2 years I will be thoroughly surprised.

3. We're still getting assets. I think the problem with most of us is we see one step. So we got that unprotected pick from LAC so we immediately go to see who may be available in the 2015 draft. I think not. Picks are like the cherry on top  of a good trade. It makes a contract that you don't necessarily like look better. We may not be able to trade Jet right out, but if we trade Jet and a first round unprotected pick, someone may be more willing to jump. However, I still do think DA is a draft god (Delonte, Rondo, Jeff, AB, Sully, etc.) and I think he'll get a wonderful pick if he does decide to use them. But I don't think he's using all of em (I'm assuming the Cavs for PP trade is true).

---------

This is all what I think and what makes sense to me. I don't think you keep a guy like Rondo, who's obviously going to want to play, in order to tank. I don't think you keep a guy like Jeff Green either. We get rid of PP, we have $15 mil off the books this year. We find something to do with KG that's $11 mil off the books. Get a long contract off the books and you'll have some more space.

DA is about to attempt to make Boston attractive. I see lots of ppl saying this is the end and that we're tanking, but I implore you to wait til AT LEAST the end of July. All we've done is gotten rid of our coach (who has a very similar first 5 years as VDN -- Doc didn't turn into a winner/"Great coach" until he got the big 3) -- so I'm just going to wait and see what happens.

I think others should too. And if I'm right, I'm extremely excited about all this.

1. Danny disintegrated the team of 2008. This will be totally accomplished when soon KP and Pp will go to [play for Doc.
2. If he is gone built around Rondo, this will be the most stupid idea. Rondo did not show any leadership skill. He is immature and overrated player.
3. Danny does not have any idea of rebuilding. From the time of trading Perk, more than 2 years form now, he did not sign any alternative to Perk.
4. If he sent out all 2008 champion team, without PP and KG who is gone be able and convinced to come and play for Danny? Can Howard, CP3, Westbrook, Gotart, Al Jefferson etc???
5. Send him out and save the Cs name and proud. Get Larry Bird for the new GM position and after that a good coach!

[sed522002]

I'm actually looking forward to this season. It might sound strange, but I'll enjoy the games better without the expectations of playoffs and "Beating the Heat". That's very nerve wrecking. That's why I'm glad I wasn't a Spurs or Heat fan...that was too much to take.

[CoachBo]

I'm actually looking forward to this season. It might sound strange, but I'll enjoy the games better without the expectations of playoffs and "Beating the Heat". That's very nerve wrecking. That's why I'm glad I wasn't a Spurs or Heat fan...that was too much to take.

As long as I live, I will never, ever agree with or understand this kind of sentiment.

Nothing whatsoever good comes from losing. Nothing.

[sed522002]

I'm actually looking forward to this season. It might sound strange, but I'll enjoy the games better without the expectations of playoffs and "Beating the Heat". That's very nerve wrecking. That's why I'm glad I wasn't a Spurs or Heat fan...that was too much to take.

As long as I live, I will never, ever agree with or understand this kind of sentiment.

Nothing whatsoever good comes from losing. Nothing.

You don't have to agree with it..that's why it's my opinion and not yours. The reality of the situation is that we're not winning a championship next year with the changes that are happening, so I'll just enjoy the games for what it's worth.

You can do whatever you feel..that's you.

[kgainez]

I'm actually looking forward to this season. It might sound strange, but I'll enjoy the games better without the expectations of playoffs and "Beating the Heat". That's very nerve wrecking. That's why I'm glad I wasn't a Spurs or Heat fan...that was too much to take.

As long as I live, I will never, ever agree with or understand this kind of sentiment.

Nothing whatsoever good comes from losing. Nothing.

I think what we're saying is there's no pressure.
all last summer it was "We want to beat the Heat...that's who are eyes are set on"...and not only did we not live up to that, we completely embarassed ourselves in the meantime.
If we get a 41-41 record, I think that's great and kind of overachievement for next years group (assuming we're doing what I think). If we go 22-60, I don't many will be surprised either.

[sed522002]

think what we're saying is there's no pressure.
all last summer it was "We want to beat the Heat...that's who are eyes are set on"...and not only did we not live up to that, we completely embarassed ourselves in the meantime.
If we get a 41-41 record, I think that's great and kind of overachievement for next years group (assuming we're doing what I think). If we go 22-60, I don't many will be surprised either.

Exactly, No one is saying that we'll enjoy sucking forever, but if you honestly think that you're going to win EVERY YEAR (with no in between or down time) then you're not in touch with reality.

[kgainez]

1. Danny disintegrated the team of 2008. This will be totally accomplished when soon KP and Pp will go to [play for Doc.
2. If he is gone built around Rondo, this will be the most stupid idea. Rondo did not show any leadership skill. He is immature and overrated player.
3. Danny does not have any idea of rebuilding. From the time of trading Perk, more than 2 years form now, he did not sign any alternative to Perk.
4. If he sent out all 2008 champion team, without PP and KG who is gone be able and convinced to come and play for Danny? Can Howard, CP3, Westbrook, Gotart, Al Jefferson etc???
5. Send him out and save the Cs name and proud. Get Larry Bird for the new GM position and after that a good coach!

1. Yea...that's the point. Great.
2. Well, that's why I think DA isn't going ALL out in creating a championship contender for Rondo. This is a test for Rondo. He'd be wise to smarten up, which I think he will.
3. Ok, guy. lol
4. I don't know what NBA you're watching but guys as old as KG and PP are not stars of their teams any more (except for in San Antonio, but you see how they didn't win it all when they could've). Vets are specialists who should be on the bench. PP would be a great bench scorer. I think KG still has some starter left in him, but he wouldn't be bad coming off the bench for a better center.
5. No.

[vinnie]

Doc Rivers made Boston attractive and the Celtics still have not gotten a top flight free agent.

A great climate makes a city attractive to top tier free agents -- forget about that one.

Low taxes make a city attractive to top tier free agents -- forget about that one.

A great nightlife with places open into the wee hours of the morning make a city attractive to top tier free agents -- forget about that one.

[vinnie]

I'm actually looking forward to this season. It might sound strange, but I'll enjoy the games better without the expectations of playoffs and "Beating the Heat". That's very nerve wrecking. That's why I'm glad I wasn't a Spurs or Heat fan...that was too much to take.

As long as I live, I will never, ever agree with or understand this kind of sentiment.

Nothing whatsoever good comes from losing. Nothing.

I could not agree with this statement more. I also could not disagree more with people who think Danny Ainge is some sort of genius. Did he make great deals to get KG and Benedict and to draft Rondo -- Yes. Beyond that the jury is out big time. And don't give me Avery Bradley who is so overrated on this blog it is laughable.

My guess is when Danny is done getting rid of the blood and guts and heart and soul of the Celtics this will be a 35-max win team next year. Hope we get to see guys like Jordan Crawford and Terrence Williams get a lot of playing time -- 

As far as the draft goes, as with any GM, he has had some great picks, some dogs, and the jury is out on the more recent picks who need more playing time to accurately determine their worth. For every good pick, I will give you JR Giddens, Troy Bell, Randy Foye, Gerald Green and Jujuan Johnson. Of course, all GMs have hits and misses and I have no idea where Ainge ranks in terms of his draft record.

[Boris Badenov]

I posted this idea in another thread, and the more info that comes out and the more I think about it, the more sense it makes.

1. Danny isn't tanking. He really can't at this point, in my opinion. Between ticket sales and the talent on this team, it's impossible. He's rebuilding the Celtic team from top to bottom. Instead of a team that focuses on two veterans to carry the team and a fairly slow pace, I think Danny has decided he wants to make this team younger. There are two reasons for this:

a. It's where the NBA is going. And I think it's ever so evident after the Spurs lost the championship. So close but so far, and the young(er) guys ended up winning.  Miami forced a game 7, that frankly shouldn't have happened, but the Spurs just ran out of gas. It's not 100% the reason (I also think in games 6 and 7 Pop just got outcoached), but it has to be unsettling, esp when your team is kind of set up the same way. The NBA is young, athletic and exciting now.

b. This is Rondo's team now. And, I believe, Rondo is admittedly a guy who likes a little bit of flash. He likes the fancy passes and the fake behind the back passes and the ooh's and the aah's. Rondo thinks he's the best PG in the league. When Rondo went out, I was tagged as anti-Rondo, but as the remainder of the season went out I realized that the 'ball pounding' and the idea that Rondo is ball-dominant seems to have come from the coaching. I think with younger guys that are athletic he'll have so much fun actually pushing the pace! And while many believe Rondo's assists will take a hit, I believe they'll actually be the same or better. Lots of lobs and wide open jumpers all day because of the way Rondo will push the ball and take advantage of defenses.

2. Danny isn't stupid and that's why the coach essentially doesn't matter for right now. Danny is going to make this Rondo's team. We already say Jackie Mac say they're gonna plaster his face everywhere. I also believe (this is speculation) that Rondo knows exactly whats going on and what's happened with Doc. Danny is essentially taking a chance on the youth movement and on Rondo. The idea is to get a cheap coach on a short contract to see if Rondo/Jeff/Sully and whomever can actually open some eyes and be competitive. If they essentially pass the test, DA will show some trust by going out and getting a better coach. And ideally, the team will have so much potential that a decent coach will be salivating to get here. If DA puts a guy like VDN on a contract longer than 2 years I will be thoroughly surprised.

3. We're still getting assets. I think the problem with most of us is we see one step. So we got that unprotected pick from LAC so we immediately go to see who may be available in the 2015 draft. I think not. Picks are like the cherry on top  of a good trade. It makes a contract that you don't necessarily like look better. We may not be able to trade Jet right out, but if we trade Jet and a first round unprotected pick, someone may be more willing to jump. However, I still do think DA is a draft god (Delonte, Rondo, Jeff, AB, Sully, etc.) and I think he'll get a wonderful pick if he does decide to use them. But I don't think he's using all of em (I'm assuming the Cavs for PP trade is true).

---------

This is all what I think and what makes sense to me. I don't think you keep a guy like Rondo, who's obviously going to want to play, in order to tank. I don't think you keep a guy like Jeff Green either. We get rid of PP, we have $15 mil off the books this year. We find something to do with KG that's $11 mil off the books. Get a long contract off the books and you'll have some more space.

DA is about to attempt to make Boston attractive. I see lots of ppl saying this is the end and that we're tanking, but I implore you to wait til AT LEAST the end of July. All we've done is gotten rid of our coach (who has a very similar first 5 years as VDN -- Doc didn't turn into a winner/"Great coach" until he got the big 3) -- so I'm just going to wait and see what happens.

I think others should too. And if I'm right, I'm extremely excited about all this.

Great post. Not sure I agree with 100% of what you say, but it's nice to see something upbeat around here!

TP.

[kgainez]

Doc Rivers made Boston attractive and the Celtics still have not gotten a top flight free agent.

A great climate makes a city attractive to top tier free agents -- forget about that one.

Low taxes make a city attractive to top tier free agents -- forget about that one.

A great nightlife with places open into the wee hours of the morning make a city attractive to top tier free agents -- forget about that one.

So then your Doc Rivers point is moot. We got Courtney Lee recently thanks to Doc. Woopty doo. I understand everything else you're saying but ultimately, guys want to play a good brand of basketball around great guys. Again, I don't think DA has even BEGUN to play out his hand. I say keep waiting and see what we end up with.