Poll - Is Jayson Tatum closer to KD or Andrew Wiggins?

[gouki88]

Paul George. Tatum is closest to Paul George than either Wiggins or Durant.

maybe in talent but not style of play.  He is much closer to Durant in that.

What? Durant doesn't have ball pounding issues like Tatum and he's a foul drawing machine.

Suspect Moranis is talking about Wiggins v Durant, for Tatum’s comparison.

[action781]

Offensively, this season for Tatum (3rd, age 21) is very similar to Wiggins 3rd season, age 21.  Both of which are a bit better than Paul George's 3rd season, age 22.  Their per-36 stats are below and all 3 of them have a TS% between 53-54%.  Durant was in another world at that age offensively and isn't even worth comparing.

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Rk           Player  Season Age  G GS   MP  FG  FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  3P%  2P  2PA  2P%  FT FTA  FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS
1       Paul George 2012-13  22 79 79 2972 6.0 14.2 .419 2.1 5.7 .362 3.9  8.6 .457 2.7 3.3 .807 1.1 6.2 7.3 4.0 1.7 0.6 2.8 2.7 16.7
2      Jayson Tatum 2019-20  21 37 37 1261 8.2 19.1 .430 2.5 6.9 .364 5.7 12.2 .467 3.6 4.1 .862 1.1 6.2 7.3 3.0 1.5 0.9 2.3 2.2 22.5
3    Andrew Wiggins 2016-17  21 82 82 3048 8.4 18.5 .452 1.2 3.4 .356 7.2 15.1 .473 4.9 6.4 .760 1.2 2.7 3.9 2.2 1.0 0.4 2.2 2.2 22.8

Defensively, Tatum is better than Wiggins at that age, but not as good as Paul George at that age.

So overall, Paul George is a fair comparison as Tatum is about as better offensively as he is worse defensively at this age.  However, PG made a big leap in year 4.  Tatum will have to improve a little bit offensively and defensively next season in order to keep up with PG.

[action781]

How are any of us supposed to know whom Tatum is closer friends with?

TP

[byennie]

Offensively, this season for Tatum (3rd, age 21) is very similar to Wiggins 3rd season, age 21.  Both of which are a bit better than Paul George's 3rd season, age 22.  Their per-36 stats are below and all 3 of them have a TS% between 53-54%.  Durant was in another world at that age offensively and isn't even worth comparing.

Code: [Select]

                                                                                                                                     
Rk           Player  Season Age  G GS   MP  FG  FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  3P%  2P  2PA  2P%  FT FTA  FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS
1       Paul George 2012-13  22 79 79 2972 6.0 14.2 .419 2.1 5.7 .362 3.9  8.6 .457 2.7 3.3 .807 1.1 6.2 7.3 4.0 1.7 0.6 2.8 2.7 16.7
2      Jayson Tatum 2019-20  21 37 37 1261 8.2 19.1 .430 2.5 6.9 .364 5.7 12.2 .467 3.6 4.1 .862 1.1 6.2 7.3 3.0 1.5 0.9 2.3 2.2 22.5
3    Andrew Wiggins 2016-17  21 82 82 3048 8.4 18.5 .452 1.2 3.4 .356 7.2 15.1 .473 4.9 6.4 .760 1.2 2.7 3.9 2.2 1.0 0.4 2.2 2.2 22.8

Defensively, Tatum is better than Wiggins at that age, but not as good as Paul George at that age.

So overall, Paul George is a fair comparison as Tatum is about as better offensively as he is worse defensively at this age.  However, PG made a big leap in year 4.  Tatum will have to improve a little bit offensively and defensively next season in order to keep up with PG.

TP for the comparison. Only one small quibble -- Paul George in year 4 is pretty darn close to Tatum, despite that leap.

22.5 on 43/36/86 with 7.3/3.0/1.5/0.9 (Tatum year 3, age 21)
21.6 on 42/36/86 with 6.7/3.5/1.9/0.3 (George year 4, age 23)

I'd say it was more like year 6 (age 25) that George was better offensively, mostly due to getting up to 7 FTA.

That said, it's an apt comparison and very close. Another variable is that scoring is really through the roof league-wide right now, which puts a bit of a damper on Tatum's numbers.

Assuming Tatum continues to improve like George and unlike Wiggins, something like:

George <= Tatum < Durant seems within reach and implies multiple-times All-Star but probably not an MVP candidate. Which is pretty darn good.

[Celtics4ever]

I think Jayson Tatum is his own man and doesn't warrant these comparisons.

[Somebody]

Paul George. Tatum is closest to Paul George than either Wiggins or Durant.

maybe in talent but not style of play.  He is much closer to Durant in that.

What? Durant doesn't have ball pounding issues like Tatum and he's a foul drawing machine.

Suspect Moranis is talking about Wiggins v Durant, for Tatum’s comparison.

I think he meant PG vs Durant, look at the message he quoted.

[jambr380]

Offensively, this season for Tatum (3rd, age 21) is very similar to Wiggins 3rd season, age 21.  Both of which are a bit better than Paul George's 3rd season, age 22.  Their per-36 stats are below and all 3 of them have a TS% between 53-54%.  Durant was in another world at that age offensively and isn't even worth comparing.

Code: [Select]

                                                                                                                                     
Rk           Player  Season Age  G GS   MP  FG  FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  3P%  2P  2PA  2P%  FT FTA  FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS
1       Paul George 2012-13  22 79 79 2972 6.0 14.2 .419 2.1 5.7 .362 3.9  8.6 .457 2.7 3.3 .807 1.1 6.2 7.3 4.0 1.7 0.6 2.8 2.7 16.7
2      Jayson Tatum 2019-20  21 37 37 1261 8.2 19.1 .430 2.5 6.9 .364 5.7 12.2 .467 3.6 4.1 .862 1.1 6.2 7.3 3.0 1.5 0.9 2.3 2.2 22.5
3    Andrew Wiggins 2016-17  21 82 82 3048 8.4 18.5 .452 1.2 3.4 .356 7.2 15.1 .473 4.9 6.4 .760 1.2 2.7 3.9 2.2 1.0 0.4 2.2 2.2 22.8

Defensively, Tatum is better than Wiggins at that age, but not as good as Paul George at that age.

So overall, Paul George is a fair comparison as Tatum is about as better offensively as he is worse defensively at this age.  However, PG made a big leap in year 4.  Tatum will have to improve a little bit offensively and defensively next season in order to keep up with PG.

According to these stats, Tatum is considerably better offensively than George in their respective 3rd years. Tatum should up his efficiency, but I don't think he needs to make a huge jump. I also think Tatum has been awesome on defense this year. I realize that has always been one of George's things, but Tatum is sneakily one of the better wing/swing defenders in the league - he is so smart on that end of the floor.

And I say all of this as somebody who 'likes' Brown more.

[droopdog7]

Offensively, this season for Tatum (3rd, age 21) is very similar to Wiggins 3rd season, age 21.  Both of which are a bit better than Paul George's 3rd season, age 22.  Their per-36 stats are below and all 3 of them have a TS% between 53-54%.  Durant was in another world at that age offensively and isn't even worth comparing.

Code: [Select]

                                                                                                                                     
Rk           Player  Season Age  G GS   MP  FG  FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  3P%  2P  2PA  2P%  FT FTA  FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS
1       Paul George 2012-13  22 79 79 2972 6.0 14.2 .419 2.1 5.7 .362 3.9  8.6 .457 2.7 3.3 .807 1.1 6.2 7.3 4.0 1.7 0.6 2.8 2.7 16.7
2      Jayson Tatum 2019-20  21 37 37 1261 8.2 19.1 .430 2.5 6.9 .364 5.7 12.2 .467 3.6 4.1 .862 1.1 6.2 7.3 3.0 1.5 0.9 2.3 2.2 22.5
3    Andrew Wiggins 2016-17  21 82 82 3048 8.4 18.5 .452 1.2 3.4 .356 7.2 15.1 .473 4.9 6.4 .760 1.2 2.7 3.9 2.2 1.0 0.4 2.2 2.2 22.8

Defensively, Tatum is better than Wiggins at that age, but not as good as Paul George at that age.

So overall, Paul George is a fair comparison as Tatum is about as better offensively as he is worse defensively at this age.  However, PG made a big leap in year 4.  Tatum will have to improve a little bit offensively and defensively next season in order to keep up with PG.

According to these stats, Tatum is considerably better offensively than George in their respective 3rd years. Tatum should up his efficiency, but I don't think he needs to make a huge jump. I also think Tatum has been awesome on defense this year. I realize that has always been one of George's things, but Tatum is sneakily one of the better wing/swing defenders in the league - he is so smart on that end of the floor.

And I say all of this as somebody who 'likes' Brown more.

I think you’re conveniently ignoring that Wiggins was right about where Tatum is at the same age.  That’s still a possibility.  And tatums efficiency has been going down, not up.  How do you assume it will go up?

[Somebody]

Offensively, this season for Tatum (3rd, age 21) is very similar to Wiggins 3rd season, age 21.  Both of which are a bit better than Paul George's 3rd season, age 22.  Their per-36 stats are below and all 3 of them have a TS% between 53-54%.  Durant was in another world at that age offensively and isn't even worth comparing.

Code: [Select]

                                                                                                                                     
Rk           Player  Season Age  G GS   MP  FG  FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  3P%  2P  2PA  2P%  FT FTA  FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS
1       Paul George 2012-13  22 79 79 2972 6.0 14.2 .419 2.1 5.7 .362 3.9  8.6 .457 2.7 3.3 .807 1.1 6.2 7.3 4.0 1.7 0.6 2.8 2.7 16.7
2      Jayson Tatum 2019-20  21 37 37 1261 8.2 19.1 .430 2.5 6.9 .364 5.7 12.2 .467 3.6 4.1 .862 1.1 6.2 7.3 3.0 1.5 0.9 2.3 2.2 22.5
3    Andrew Wiggins 2016-17  21 82 82 3048 8.4 18.5 .452 1.2 3.4 .356 7.2 15.1 .473 4.9 6.4 .760 1.2 2.7 3.9 2.2 1.0 0.4 2.2 2.2 22.8

Defensively, Tatum is better than Wiggins at that age, but not as good as Paul George at that age.

So overall, Paul George is a fair comparison as Tatum is about as better offensively as he is worse defensively at this age.  However, PG made a big leap in year 4.  Tatum will have to improve a little bit offensively and defensively next season in order to keep up with PG.

According to these stats, Tatum is considerably better offensively than George in their respective 3rd years. Tatum should up his efficiency, but I don't think he needs to make a huge jump. I also think Tatum has been awesome on defense this year. I realize that has always been one of George's things, but Tatum is sneakily one of the better wing/swing defenders in the league - he is so smart on that end of the floor.

And I say all of this as somebody who 'likes' Brown more.

Yes, Somebody does "like" Brown more!

[Moranis]

Paul George. Tatum is closest to Paul George than either Wiggins or Durant.

maybe in talent but not style of play.  He is much closer to Durant in that.

What? Durant doesn't have ball pounding issues like Tatum and he's a foul drawing machine.

Suspect Moranis is talking about Wiggins v Durant, for Tatum’s comparison.

I think he meant PG vs Durant, look at the message he quoted.

I did.  I think Tatum's game more closely resembles Durant over George.  Both defensively and offensively.  Just in how they play.  Tatum's talent level is much closer to George though. 

George is much more outside oriented offensively.  He shoots a lot more 3's and long 2's and a lot less dunks or short range shots.  In fact only 29.2% of George's shots have been inside 10' and only about 11.7% come from 10-16'.  Durant and Tatum take a much larger percentage of their shots inside and a much lower percentage from 3 or long 2.  Durant is a much better shooter than Tatum from basically everywhere, but stylistically I think they are fairly similar. 

The same is also true defensively.  Durant and Tatum are more stylistically similar defenders i.e. solid man defenders, but elite level team defenders, who aren't the most physically aggressive or imposing defensively.  George on the other hand is an elite man defender that uses his physical size and strength far more effectively than either Durant or Tatum.

[SHAQATTACK]

Wiggins = Jeff Green

[RockinRyA]

Paul George. Tatum is closest to Paul George than either Wiggins or Durant.

maybe in talent but not style of play.  He is much closer to Durant in that.

What? Durant doesn't have ball pounding issues like Tatum and he's a foul drawing machine.

Suspect Moranis is talking about Wiggins v Durant, for Tatum’s comparison.

I think he meant PG vs Durant, look at the message he quoted.

I did.  I think Tatum's game more closely resembles Durant over George.  Both defensively and offensively.  Just in how they play.  Tatum's talent level is much closer to George though.

Agree with this. Although Id say George is still a lot better.

[Somebody]

I know people are going crazy over the 3rd year comparisons of Tatum and PG shown in the above posts, but there are a few things to note:

1. Paul George took an insane leap in his 4th season and made another jump after his injury, I don't think we can reasonably expect Tatum to show that kind of explosive growth (he does have an extra couple of years to fall back on, but I'm not sure if we can say that he can make that leap into a FT drawing machine and a viable primary halfcourt creator).

2. If you really want to compare slash lines from different seasons (I dislike this sort of comparison, box stats are pretty bad at capturing a player's offensive impact because they don't account for role and the quality of the box stats), you should adjust for pace and the state of the league in those years. For example, you should look at points/assists per 75/100 possessions as well as TS% and TOV% relative to league average that season to get an idea of their 4 dimensions.

Their "big 4" numbers:
13-14 George: 23.325 points per 75, 3.825 assists per 75, +1.4% TS, -1.1% TOV
19-20 Tatum: 22.65 points per 75, 3.075 assists per 75, -2.9% TS, -2.1% TOV
16-17 Wiggins: 24.15 points per 75, 2.325 assists per 75, -1.8% TS, -3.3% TOV

And here's a poorly made graph lol (I apologise for my atrocious excel skills )

[Somebody]

Paul George. Tatum is closest to Paul George than either Wiggins or Durant.

maybe in talent but not style of play.  He is much closer to Durant in that.

What? Durant doesn't have ball pounding issues like Tatum and he's a foul drawing machine.

Suspect Moranis is talking about Wiggins v Durant, for Tatum’s comparison.

I think he meant PG vs Durant, look at the message he quoted.

I did.  I think Tatum's game more closely resembles Durant over George.  Both defensively and offensively.  Just in how they play.  Tatum's talent level is much closer to George though. 

George is much more outside oriented offensively.  He shoots a lot more 3's and long 2's and a lot less dunks or short range shots.  In fact only 29.2% of George's shots have been inside 10' and only about 11.7% come from 10-16'.  Durant and Tatum take a much larger percentage of their shots inside and a much lower percentage from 3 or long 2.  Durant is a much better shooter than Tatum from basically everywhere, but stylistically I think they are fairly similar. 

The same is also true defensively.  Durant and Tatum are more stylistically similar defenders i.e. solid man defenders, but elite level team defenders, who aren't the most physically aggressive or imposing defensively.  George on the other hand is an elite man defender that uses his physical size and strength far more effectively than either Durant or Tatum.

Fair points, their shot profiles are quite similar even though I think the way they get shots are vastly different (Durant has a "looser" handle that uses crossovers and hesitation moves for pullups instead of Tatum's inside-out dribbles and between the legs for stepbacks, he drives to the rim by dancing around/taking a stride past his defender instead of pounding the ball between his legs ten times to create a driving lane, etc), Tatum's style reminds me more of a mix between George and Pierce (FWIW Tatum has a similar shot profile with Pierce if you swap his floaters for midrange jumpers).

As for defence I'm inclined to agree with your point although I think that Tatum is better at team defence than Durant ever was due to his awareness to disrupt passing lanes/drives, as well as PG being an elite man and team defender.

[jambr380]

Offensively, this season for Tatum (3rd, age 21) is very similar to Wiggins 3rd season, age 21.  Both of which are a bit better than Paul George's 3rd season, age 22.  Their per-36 stats are below and all 3 of them have a TS% between 53-54%.  Durant was in another world at that age offensively and isn't even worth comparing.

Code: [Select]

                                                                                                                                     
Rk           Player  Season Age  G GS   MP  FG  FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  3P%  2P  2PA  2P%  FT FTA  FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS
1       Paul George 2012-13  22 79 79 2972 6.0 14.2 .419 2.1 5.7 .362 3.9  8.6 .457 2.7 3.3 .807 1.1 6.2 7.3 4.0 1.7 0.6 2.8 2.7 16.7
2      Jayson Tatum 2019-20  21 37 37 1261 8.2 19.1 .430 2.5 6.9 .364 5.7 12.2 .467 3.6 4.1 .862 1.1 6.2 7.3 3.0 1.5 0.9 2.3 2.2 22.5
3    Andrew Wiggins 2016-17  21 82 82 3048 8.4 18.5 .452 1.2 3.4 .356 7.2 15.1 .473 4.9 6.4 .760 1.2 2.7 3.9 2.2 1.0 0.4 2.2 2.2 22.8

Defensively, Tatum is better than Wiggins at that age, but not as good as Paul George at that age.

So overall, Paul George is a fair comparison as Tatum is about as better offensively as he is worse defensively at this age.  However, PG made a big leap in year 4.  Tatum will have to improve a little bit offensively and defensively next season in order to keep up with PG.

According to these stats, Tatum is considerably better offensively than George in their respective 3rd years. Tatum should up his efficiency, but I don't think he needs to make a huge jump. I also think Tatum has been awesome on defense this year. I realize that has always been one of George's things, but Tatum is sneakily one of the better wing/swing defenders in the league - he is so smart on that end of the floor.

And I say all of this as somebody who 'likes' Brown more.

I think you’re conveniently ignoring that Wiggins was right about where Tatum is at the same age.  That’s still a possibility.  And tatums efficiency has been going down, not up.  How do you assume it will go up?

I think others have made some solid points above me, but stats don't tell the whole story and guys like Wiggins, Booker, and Lavine (up to the 3rd years of their respective careers) just weren't anywhere near the same level as Tatum. None of them contributed to winning basketball and all 3 were (are) very sub-par defenders.

It's great that those guys can get points, but Tatum's size, versatility, and almost elite level defensive skills put him in a higher class than those guys. It's just not a contest.