Per 100 Possessions:
Allen: 19.6 points, 18.3 rebounds, 2.8 blocks
Timelord: 19.8 points, 19.0 rebounds, 4.4 blocks, 101 DRtg
Thompson: 17.4 points, 17.6 rebounds, 1.6 blocks, 111 DRtg
Theis: 15.8 points, 9.6 rebounds, 2.1 blocks, 112 DRtg
Theis (last year): 18.5 points, 13.1 rebounds, 2.6 blocks, 105 DRtg
I’m just not sure what difference Allen would make. He seems quite duplicative.
I posted this in the other thread too, but I'm reposting it here to address your question.
Timelord ain't a good fit in our defensive system. The way our PnR defense works, Theis/Thompson meet the opposing ball handler at the level of dribble hand off and deny penetration. Timelord ain't got the lateral quicks to play D on the perimeter, hence he drops back and protects the rim. To put it another way, whenever Timelord is on the court, we have to change our defensive system. The C's are built around Tatum and Brown. They are both versatile defenders who can guard multiple positions. If we want to maximize their effectiveness, we gotta start a big man who can play D on the perimeter.
Is Jarrett Allen a good perimeter defender? Hard to say, cause the Nets were using him in a drop scheme, just like we do with Timelord. Imo, he's a better perimeter defender than Timelord, but worse than Theis and Thompson.
Is his defense a problem? Our defensive has been excellent — elite, even — with him in the game. He is obviously still learning, but the progress he has made is remarkable.
I’m curious, why do you make the assumption that Williams plays in a drop scheme because that’s the only thing he can do well, but don’t apply the same standard to Allen? Allen has had way more games and more years in the league to figure it out, but still doesn’t switch on the perimeter.
What I like about Williams is that his production has increased every year so far. That’s not the case with Allen, who has been remarkably consistent on a permanent basis since his rookie season.
Timelord is outproducing Allen now, and has higher potential. He also has only been in the league three years, compared to four for Allen.
I just don’t understand where you are seeing separation. Their size is similar, their athleticism and speed are similar, their production is similar. The only major differences are that Williams has a year longer on his contract, and that Williams has already shown that he fits into this team. Where are you seeing a gap that justifies Theis and a first rounder?
No he doesn't. Unfortunately, he can't play D on the perimeter. Imo, this is the one thing that holds him back. Had he been a better perimeter defender, he would have probably become our starting Center by now. In a vacuum, I really believe he's our best Center.
Each team runs a different defensive scheme. The C's have 2 amazing switchable wings, hence our starting unit is switching pretty much everything on defense. Do I think that Allen would have been the perfect fit for us? Certainly not. I believe he's at his best when used in a drop scheme. That being said, imo he's a better perimeter defender than Timelord.
Where are you seeing a gap that justifies Theis and a first rounder?
Theis + BOS 2021 first for Allen + Prince
Prince ain't a world-beater, but he ain't terrible either. Plus, he plays a position of need for us. I bet he would have been starting at the swing positions till Kemba and Romeo come back.
OK, so we are trading our best center at perimeter defense, plus a 1st, plus taking on $13 million in salary next year (in turn, using up $13 million of the TPE and pushing us near the luxury tax line) for ... what? A mediocre wing and a center who is inferior to Robert Williams in a drop scheme and who is a lesser defender on the perimeter than either Thompson or Theis (and arguably Williams)?
This isn’t even a lateral move. It is potentially a team-killing one with the salary implications.
A ''potentially team-killing move''? Wow! We would be getting our starting Center possibly for the next decade for the price of a role player who's about to hit UFA this summer + a late first. If you ask me, that's a no-brainer. Prince would have been a solid rotation player in a position of need for us.
Again, I don't think Timelord can become our starting Center, otherwise I wouldn't have been advocating in favour of the trade.
I'm with you on Theis. He's our best perimeter defender at the Center position. That being said, Allen is hands down the better overall player, plus he's considerably younger. We'd still have a great perimeter defender at Center in Thompson. We'd still have Timelord as well. He's an amazing option off the bench. Pritchard and Teague aren't switchable defenders. No need for a switchable big man in our second unit. We can hide one non-switchable defender (Kemba). Can't hide multiple non-switchable defenders.
Team killing in the financial implications, yes:
1. Luxury tax concerns this season, which would lead to repeater tax concerns soon;
2. Prince’s $13 million in salary plus the cost of signing Allen ($16 million?) is almost a max contract;
3. We’d be wasting $13 million of our TPE, and our financial situation would be so tight next year that we would probably never use the other half of it.
Team-killing.
What are you talking about? As things stand right now, the C's are $15,112,416 below the tax line. Had we made the trade, we would have ended up $3,952,514 below the tax line. That's including Javonte Green's salary which is partially(?) non-guaranteed till February 27. If we include the savings from Green's contract, we would have ended up +4 million below the tax line. I bet we would have cut Green cause it would have been a 2-for-1 trade.
Right, our flexibility to add to the team at the deadline is severely restricted, as things get tight.
And, of course, you ignored the second and third point.
So, what are you talking about? Other than a terrible trade idea? It’s not often that I see fans argue so ardently for trades that don’t make us better, but do cost us draft capital and kill our financial flexibility and eat up our TPE.
Whatever man. I only ignored your 2nd and 3rd points cause your first one was flat out wrong.
Sitting on a $28,500,000 TPE is nice. At some point we have to use it, otherwise it will just expire. Whenever we use it, our future flexibility is gonna be restricted. I see no problem in using part of it in a trade for a terrific young Center. We'd still have a remaining TPE of $16,250,000.
Let's just say that we agree to disagree. That ship has sailed anyway. Don't think we can trade for Allen anymore. If the Cavs are willing to sign and trade Allen this summer, I'd happily use the TPE. Don't think it's a likely scenario though.
