Author Topic: Danny's overriding commitment to banners  (Read 1816 times)

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Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« on: September 16, 2018, 05:38:55 AM »

Offline rollie mass

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The trading of Paul Pierce and Garnet.The hiring of Brad, the merry go round of trading and finally getting a catalyst Isaiah.The failed pursuit of Winslow.Then comes Horford the first free agent.
The trading down to get Jason, the sacrifice of his sons political ambitions in pursuit and signing of another top free  agent, Hayward. Then the ruthless trade of Isaiah for Kyrie with the NETS pick. Crowder was gone with signing Hayward and lets not forget trading home grown Avery leaving Marcus the longest tenured Celtic

What we have is a relentless drive for Banner 18 but will this pursuit override the precarious position that Kyrie, we assume puts Danny in.
We are essentially playing back the same team as last pre season but vetted by the playoff run adding an all star.

Kyrie has been freed from Lebron and gotten everything he wants organization,coaching,history,young talented hard working kids but there are franchises bigger than a star and Ainge represents that one.
Kyrie will be finally be free to make his own decision where he wants to play.Will he take up the gauntlet and attempt to rescue the Knicks elevating himself to Lebron proportions while living in a city that suits his character.
This worries me as a fan and takes away from my enjoying Kyrie. Will what makes Kyrie so special force Danny to preempt losing him for nothing? Or will the possibility of a single Banner override everything?Will his Celtics teammates and organization be enough?Will preseason and early season success be enough to quiet those whispers in our heads that the media fans.

Without any facts, I feel  the challenge of bringing the Knicks back to relevance in Madison square Garden with the NYC lifestyle fitting Kyrie ,it might win out but that will only happen with a healthy Porzingis .
Kyries failure to verbally commit and maybe it is just a matter of time but it emboldens New York This might have them upping the ante in a trade right now rather than have Kyrie decide to stay in Boston.Then again if Danny feels that chance of a Banner this year is stronger and Al getting older he may just roll the dice.
.What would you do if you were Danny?






Re: Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2018, 07:15:57 AM »

Offline Sophomore

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Don’t think NYK has players and assets we want nearly as much as KI. A trade would be a big step back in a year where we have a real shot to win the title. And if the reason for a trade is that we can’t hang onto him, we won’t find another team to give us major assets for a part-year rental.

I also am not one who believes all the KI to NYK talk. From the outside the team culture looks positive and the players get along. They’re set for a long run of greatness. Will he leave that to play for a disfunctional outfit like the NYK - and get bounced from the playoffs by the Celtics, Bucks, Sixers, Toronto, Pacers for the life of his next contract???
« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 07:22:06 AM by Sophomore »

Re: Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2018, 07:30:54 AM »

Offline rollie mass

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TP=Well put--

Re: Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2018, 08:15:29 AM »

Offline Eddie20

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Don’t think NYK has players and assets we want nearly as much as KI. A trade would be a big step back in a year where we have a real shot to win the title. And if the reason for a trade is that we can’t hang onto him, we won’t find another team to give us major assets for a part-year rental.

I also am not one who believes all the KI to NYK talk. From the outside the team culture looks positive and the players get along. They’re set for a long run of greatness. Will he leave that to play for a disfunctional outfit like the NYK - and get bounced from the playoffs by the Celtics, Bucks, Sixers, Toronto, Pacers for the life of his next contract???


What's been dysfunctional about the Knicks since Phil Jackson left? They drafted two good prospects (Knox and Robinson), will be getting a high lottery pick in 2019 as Porzingis won't be rushed back, and will potentially have the cap room to sign 2 impact players in the summer. The reports are the cap will spoke next off-season, so that along with a salary dump (Hardaway) and perhaps two players that want to play together (Irving and Buter) make them a threat to make a quick turnaround.

Irving has also said the following about wanting to play with Porzingis:
The Celtics point guard also revealed that he paid Porzingis a compliment when the Knicks played in Boston in October earlier this season.
“I told him I would love to play with a big like you, man, when we played them in the beginning of the season when he came to Boston,’’ Irving said during the media session after practice on Saturday. “He’s so versatile. So I wish him nothing but the best and hope he comes back even stronger.”

So, yeah, I definitely do think the Knicks could have a big 3 of Irving, Porzingis, and Butler, with a young core of 2019 top 10 pick (or higher), Knox, Ntlikina, and Robinson in supporting roles.

Re: Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2018, 10:18:49 AM »

Offline jambr380

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What's been dysfunctional about the Knicks since Phil Jackson left? They drafted two good prospects (Knox and Robinson), will be getting a high lottery pick in 2019 as Porzingis won't be rushed back, and will potentially have the cap room to sign 2 impact players in the summer. The reports are the cap will spoke next off-season, so that along with a salary dump (Hardaway) and perhaps two players that want to play together (Irving and Buter) make them a threat to make a quick turnaround.

Irving has also said the following about wanting to play with Porzingis:
The Celtics point guard also revealed that he paid Porzingis a compliment when the Knicks played in Boston in October earlier this season.
“I told him I would love to play with a big like you, man, when we played them in the beginning of the season when he came to Boston,’’ Irving said during the media session after practice on Saturday. “He’s so versatile. So I wish him nothing but the best and hope he comes back even stronger.”

So, yeah, I definitely do think the Knicks could have a big 3 of Irving, Porzingis, and Butler, with a young core of 2019 top 10 pick (or higher), Knox, Ntlikina, and Robinson in supporting roles.

I know what you are saying, but almost every team would look 'awesome' if you added two in their prime all-star FAs to their current roster. The thing is, it just almost never happens. I get it, Miami was able to get Lebron and Bosh to join Wade, but just about every team fails when trying to accomplish this (Lakers this year, us with Durant/Horford, etc).

And also, Mitchell Robinson? Maybe he'll turn out to be something, but counting on a 2nd round rookie to turn into a surefire impact player is quite hopeful.

The Knicks finally have a direction in which to go, and I could absolutely see them signing a player like Butler next year, but everything would have to go extremely well if they were to sign Irving, Butler, salary dump Hardaway, and have all of their young draft picks greatly exceed expectations. Also, they desperately need Porzingis to come back healthy or they are pretty much back at square one.

Re: Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2018, 10:57:54 AM »

Offline Sophomore

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Irving has also said the following about wanting to play with Porzingis:
The Celtics point guard also revealed that he paid Porzingis a compliment when the Knicks played in Boston in October earlier this season. “I told him I would love to play with a big like you, man, when we played them in the beginning of the season when he came to Boston,’’ Irving said during the media session after practice on Saturday. “He’s so versatile. So I wish him nothing but the best and hope he comes back even stronger.”

The quotes don't move me much. Kyrie seems to be one of the more popular players around the league - there are so many videos of him hanging out with other players both on and off the court. He seems to have complementary things to say about all the other stars and I think it comes off as authentic. When the media (or fans of another team) want to start a story about him going somewhere else they can almost always point to complimentary things he's said.

He's also said great things about players on the Celtics. Remember his intro in 2017 - smiling at Hayward and saying "it's about to be crazy, G"? He still talks like that. https://www.barstoolsports.com/boston/its-about-to-be-crazy-g-kyrie-irving. Heck, you can find him saying great things about Sue Bird as a player, but I don't think he's going to play with her.

If we think he's going to NYK to play with Butler there's a more fundamental problem: the Knicks don't have room for two max free agents under the cap - not even close. They have over $60 millon committed to nine players in 2019-20 (thanks to $38 million for Tim Hardaway and Joakim Noah(!)) and that is before they find money to resign Porzingis. If KP is back to his old level he's going to want a max or near-max deal. The Knicks will have to pull out all the stops (like waiving Noah and stretching his contract) even to find room for one max contract - forget two. So maybe Kyrie can go there to play with Porzingis (who may or may not be healthy) but not to join up with Butler. Somewhere a while back saltlover outlined all this. Which means - unless you like the Knicks roster a lot more than I do, he's not getting back to the Finals without some really awesome deal-making by the Knicks management over the years that follow.

And there are other big question marks. Like their owner (maybe Fizdale is the cure, but Dolan is still there) and the rest of the roster. I would not want to bet the farm on a 7'2" player who plays a perimeter game, doesn't seem to know how to pass, and has to come back from a torn ACL. If he isn't back to all-star form that is a bottom-dwelling team; even if he's healthy they're a fringe playoff team at best.

Could Kyrie go to the Knicks? Of course. Who knows what people want? Manhattan is unique and those who love it love it.  But I just haven't heard anything solid or remotely solid on this, and he's not going to the Knicks to play with Butler.  If he is really desperate to get to NYC to play with Butler the Nets should be able to pay them, but that team is definitely not going to the finals without many more moves.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 11:04:11 AM by Sophomore »

Re: Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2018, 11:20:08 AM »

Offline timpiker

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I'm so glad we have Kyrie and the team we do...  I know it makes no sense that any player would want to leave all of this.  I'm just p---ed that I can't sit back and enjoy it without the fear that Kyrie leaves. 

Re: Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2018, 03:04:38 PM »

Offline Big333223

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I keep going back to Kevin Arnovitz saying "My best intel is that the Celtics and Kyrie have a pretty good mutual understanding. There are long term aspirations for both parties."

It's not definitely true and things can change but Arnovitz is a pretty serious guy and I trust he wouldn't say that if he didn't actually have information he was confident about. A lot of the Kyrie-to-New York reporting feels very "what if" to me. It could be confirmation bias but Arnovitz's statement actually feels real.

Or maybe it's because Arnovitz actually put his name on it and called it "my intel" as opposed to "I heard someone else talking about this is there opinion.
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Re: Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2018, 09:54:12 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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I'm so glad we have Kyrie and the team we do...  I know it makes no sense that any player would want to leave all of this.  I'm just p---ed that I can't sit back and enjoy it without the fear that Kyrie leaves.

If he doesn't want to play for the Boston Celtics with a title contending group - and want it badly - then screw him and all his BS "uniqueness." I don't want a headcase who doesn't work hard enough on defense to fight over the top of a pick all year long. Have we ever had a star Celtic on a title group who didn't love being here ? Anyone we had to "worry about" all the time ? I can think of one and his name was Sidney Wicks. Yep.
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Re: Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2018, 09:55:56 PM »

Offline CelticsElite

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I'm so glad we have Kyrie and the team we do...  I know it makes no sense that any player would want to leave all of this.  I'm just p---ed that I can't sit back and enjoy it without the fear that Kyrie leaves.

If he doesn't want to play for the Boston Celtics with a title contending group - and want it badly - then screw him and all his BS "uniqueness." I don't want a headcase who doesn't work hard enough on defense to fight over the top of a pick all year long. Have we ever had a star Celtic on a title group who didn't love being here ? Anyone we had to "worry about" all the time ? I can think of one and his name was Sidney Wicks. Yep.
did you see our record with kyrie ? We were really good. And that’s without Hayward

Defense or not, wins means he was doing something right 

Re: Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2018, 10:05:59 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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I'm so glad we have Kyrie and the team we do...  I know it makes no sense that any player would want to leave all of this.  I'm just p---ed that I can't sit back and enjoy it without the fear that Kyrie leaves.

If he doesn't want to play for the Boston Celtics with a title contending group - and want it badly - then screw him and all his BS "uniqueness." I don't want a headcase who doesn't work hard enough on defense to fight over the top of a pick all year long. Have we ever had a star Celtic on a title group who didn't love being here ? Anyone we had to "worry about" all the time ? I can think of one and his name was Sidney Wicks. Yep.
did you see our record with kyrie ? We were really good. And that’s without Hayward

Defense or not, wins means he was doing something right

He is a great offensive player.
The Four Celtic Generals:
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Re: Danny's overriding commitment to banners
« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2018, 05:55:50 AM »

Offline iadera

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There's just no worry regarding Kyrie. Sooner than we think, AD will be available and that's where Kyrie fits in. After that, nobody would remember Kyrie.