What's a Knicks trade offer for Davis that beats ours?

[mef730]

So help me out with this. There's a lot of discussion about the Knicks being able to top our offer if they get the top pick. I just don't get it.

Assume that they win the lottery and now have a shot at Zion. I get it, the guy's incredible. I have no doubt that he's going to be a successful NBA player. But he's played half a season of college basketball, and two of the next three best college players are on his team, so he doesn't have to play against them.

So what's the offer that the Knicks can put together? Is it him, Knox, Ntilikina and salary? And does that beat an offer headlined by the Memphis pick and Tatum?

Enquiring minds want to know. Also, it's fun to find out what makes an ocean wave wave. And it's fun to find out what your voice really sounds like.

Mike

[Kuberski33]

The Knicks I think have no chance due to the ownership. 

[Surferdad]

#1 pick and Porzingis.

[slamtheking]

#1 pick and Porzingis.

an unproven draft pick that's an undersized PF (though a very athletic one) and an oft-injured 'unicorn' vs a proven top pick (even though taken at #3) and multiple first round picks and other proven players added to match salary?

Knick's can't touch what the C's can offer.

[Surferdad]

#1 pick and Porzingis.

an unproven draft pick that's an undersized PF (though a very athletic one) and an oft-injured 'unicorn' vs a proven top pick (even though taken at #3) and multiple first round picks and other proven players added to match salary?

Knick's can't touch what the C's can offer.

I'm not sure.  If NYK really get the #1 pick, that beat any picks the C's can offer.

[JBcat]

#1 pick and Porzingis.

an unproven draft pick that's an undersized PF (though a very athletic one) and an oft-injured 'unicorn' vs a proven top pick (even though taken at #3) and multiple first round picks and other proven players added to match salary?

Knick's can't touch what the C's can offer.

I think you are underselling Zion.  I think he can be a complete game changer on a team.

[Monkhouse]

#1 pick and Porzingis.

an unproven draft pick that's an undersized PF (though a very athletic one) and an oft-injured 'unicorn' vs a proven top pick (even though taken at #3) and multiple first round picks and other proven players added to match salary?

Knick's can't touch what the C's can offer.

I'm not sure.  If NYK really get the #1 pick, that beat any picks the C's can offer.

And we still have Tatum, Brown, or Rozier S & T.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

Porzingis is a good player, but we shouldn't get carried away.

On a lottery team, he put up 23 points and 7 rebounds on 44/44/79 shooting with 2 TOs and only 1 assist per game.

His efficiency is a big concern moving forward. For a 7'3'' guy only 33% of his shots come within 10 feet of the rim, and only half of those are at the rim. 43% of his shots are mid-range. He shoots alright mid-range, but that is not a reliable scoring distribution.

On top of that, he is a pretty bad rebounder. Al Horford has never had as bad of a season per36 as Porzingis had last year, and he's considered an average rebounder for his position.

He's not agile enough to guard guards on the perimeter. He's a bit of a ball-hog with a pretty poor courtview for passing.

He had a 31% usage on a 29 win team. This is typical good-player-inflated-stats-bad-team stuff.

I'm not even sure he is as good as Chris Bosh was at the height of his career, or Lemarcus Aldridge. He is more like a Bargnani-strong type player.

On top of all that, there are real concerns about his long-term health. He hopefully will come back fully healthy from this ACL tear, but 7'3'' guys don't last in the league.

If the Pelicans are looking to build a real team, I think they'd much rather have either Lakers, or the Celtics, or even another team's trade package.

Obviously the potential 1st overall pick is a big part of the Knicks' package, but even if they finish with the worst record, there is still only a 1 in 6 chance they get the first pick.

[GreenEnvy]

#1 pick and Porzingis.

an unproven draft pick that's an undersized PF (though a very athletic one) and an oft-injured 'unicorn' vs a proven top pick (even though taken at #3) and multiple first round picks and other proven players added to match salary?

Knick's can't touch what the C's can offer.

Are you referring to Zion? He’s about as undersized as LeBron is. And very athletic is an insult, he’s a freak athlete who will only get better.

Of course there are two very big if’s: if the Knicks win the lottery and if they would include that pick for AD. I think they would give up KP but not both. I’d guess they probably go in a different direction with Zion, Zinger, and bring in a max free agent. Build around those three, who will be very fun to watch for two seasons before they get serious about competing.

Now if the Knicks don’t win the lottery, they can’t touch the C’s. Zion probably trumps everything though. An extra two years of rookie control over Tatum and the upside is insane.

[Monkhouse]

By the way, you guys are kidding me...

1st round pick is great and all, but is it really that much better than Tatum, 3-4 first round picks, and Rozier/Morris?

Reporting with @ZachLowe and @RamonaShelburne: In meeting with management today, Knicks forward Kristaps Porzingis expressed his concern with the losing, franchise direction and an uncertainty that a culture is developing that will enable sustainable organizational success.

[Smartacus]

With all do respect IMO some of you are way underselling Zion Williamson.

He is unequivocally the best available talent that New Orleans could come away with. Tatum is an incredible player at the NBA Level but there's no comparison what the two of them were able to accomplish at Duke. As I said in another post RJ Barrett might be as good or better than Tatum at the NBA level but Zion Williamson is arguably the best prospect since... Anthony Davis.

The NBA is a star driven league and while it's not hard to imagine a team of Jayson Tatum, Jaylen and the players they recoup off picks spinning their tires in a crowded Western Conference, Zion Williamson allows you to build for a clean slate future. They could be free to rebuild slowly for a year or two and when Zion is ready, make a real push with a new downhill style identity that might just fit better with Alvin Gentry than the AD era.

I don't know how interested NOP would be in Porzingis but he would definitely have value across the league to net the type of player that would be a better fit for NOP's roster construction and timeline.

Trust me I want AD as much as anyone in Boston but let's not discredit the Knicks offer if they come away with the number 1 pick. Never thought I'd say this but I'm actually starting to root for Cleveland to come away with Zion.

[mef730]

I don't see KP and Zion going out in the same trade. The sign & trade requirement for KP would be too much of a nightmare. And why would he agree to it?

I'm more worried about Zion and a bunch of the young guys (see OP).

Mike

[Sophomore]

So help me out with this. There's a lot of discussion about the Knicks being able to top our offer if they get the top pick. I just don't get it.

Assume that they win the lottery and now have a shot at Zion. I get it, the guy's incredible. I have no doubt that he's going to be a successful NBA player. But he's played half a season of college basketball, and two of the next three best college players are on his team, so he doesn't have to play against them.

So what's the offer that the Knicks can put together? Is it him, Knox, Ntilikina and salary? And does that beat an offer headlined by the Memphis pick and Tatum?


Mike

I'm torn. I keep talking myself into and out of Zion for AD for the Pellies.

From the NOP perspective, I think four years of Zion plus the RFA at the end of that deal is awfully enticing.  Look at what Doncic has done in his rookie year. Look at what AD was able to in his. Even Ayton. Zion is basically breaking college basketball; he might do awfully well in the pros right away - he's definitely ready physically. Given his unique size and power, he's also a guy who might fill seats even in New Orleans. I love AD's game, but I'm a basketball nut. AD is so efficient and smooth that he can drop 40 and 15 and people will say - why didn't he do more? I don't think the ordinary fan gets it. There's a level of holy sh*t to a 280-pound guy who just might dunk from the foul line.  I don't think Tatum plus some likely mid-first round picks is clearly better, from a basketball or a filling-the-seats perspective. Tatum's ceiling, to me, is poor man's Durant. Williamson's ceiling is rich-man's LeBron.

Our offer gets a little better because we need to include more than Tatum to make the salaries work. Very likely Marcus or Jaylen, which is a real shame. So now we are offering at least two young, good, proven NBA players who will fit right in to the NOP roster. That ups the value of our offer, which matters if the Pellies want to win now, Holiday-Smart-Tatum or Holiday-Brown-Tatum would give them a very nice 1-2-3 - better than Boston had last year when they made the ECF (sorry, Terry). Add a couple 1st round picks, and the Pellies are getting a lot. Knox and Ntilikina have potential, but they aren't anything like Smart or Brown if the team doesn't want to spend a few years seasoning them up. NOP could end up with Zion and a hot mess.

End of the day? I really don't know. I can see it either way.

[Monkhouse]

With all do respect IMO some of you are way underselling Zion Williamson.

He is unequivocally the best available talent that New Orleans could come away with. Tatum is an incredible player at the NBA Level but there's no comparison what the two of them were able to accomplish at Duke. As I said in another post RJ Barrett might be as good or better than Tatum at the NBA level but Zion Williamson is arguably the best prospect since... Anthony Davis.

The NBA is a star driven league and while it's not hard to imagine a team of Jayson Tatum, Jaylen and the players they recoup off picks spinning their tires in a crowded Western Conference, Zion Williamson allows you to build for a clean slate future. They could be free to rebuild slowly for a year or two and when Zion is ready, make a real push with a new downhill style identity that might just fit better with Alvin Gentry than the AD era.

I don't know how interested NOP would be in Porzingis but he would definitely have value across the league to net the type of player that would be a better fit for NOP's roster construction and timeline.

Trust me I want AD as much as anyone in Boston but let's not discredit the Knicks offer if they come away with the number 1 pick. Never though I'd say this but I'm actually starting to root for Cleveland to come away with Zion.

I'm very high on Zion too, but one can also proclaim that his skill set, lack of shooting, and the fact that he JOINED one of the most stacked teams in collegiate history, can argue that his numbers in college are supremely overrated/inflated.

He's a freak of nature. Don't get me wrong, his dunks and ability to catch lobs will be fun to watch. But his ball handling is still suspect, his defense especially man to man is solid, but needs A LOT OF improvement. And his weakside shot blocking is exciting to watch when it happens, but generally for someone with great vertical, he always seem to be a step behind.

[Smartacus]

I don't see KP and Zion going out in the same trade. The sign & trade requirement for KP would be too much of a nightmare. And why would he agree to it?

I'm more worried about Zion and a bunch of the young guys (see OP).

Mike

That being said if they could Sign and Trade Porzingis to the Spurs, Sacramento or Dallas and come away with the type of player that could put a Zion + young guys deal over the top then that's a compelling situation for the Pelicans.