NBC Sport and race article

[Kaz]

I think it is an outdated stereotype.  Boston is a pretty diverse city now and I don't think the city is any worse at dealing with racism than the likes of Chicago, Philadelphia, DC, etc.

I think it is much bigger deal for a city like Salt Lake City that is still considered a mainly "white city".  Which is why there was extra heartbreak when Gordie left them

[rollie mass]

As the OP,  the theme of this article made me furious,as it attempted to incite prejudice and reverse prejudice.   
 NBC Sport should not have to stoop so low as to troll with the race card.
Danny went after an All Star Hayward even with his son running for election in Utah .Danny bleeds green not white or black.
I didn't follow Hayward when he was in Utah and i couldn't bear to watch him till very recently He had no burst ,no lift and no aggression going to hoop just drive and kick but i knew that Brad and Danny were sticking to his minutes and not sending him down to G League because that may have been psychologically damaging or could have stunted his recovery with an injury.
I was hoping maybe a moderator  or poster could complain to NBC Sport or confront the author.

 

[ozgod]

White guys tend to be a little more popular in Boston than they are in some other cities/areas

I wonder if that’s even true on a wide scale. 

Looking at the two guys mentioned in this thread, Scal was a human victory cigar in Chicago, too. And Scal’s celebrity was in large part because he was a goofy pale redhead who had no gracefulness, but tried hard. The other player mentioned is Larry Bird, who would have been idolized by any fan base.

I see professional sport as being one of the few true meritocracies today. As fans we want our team to win. That means we want good players that will help us win, wherever they come from or whether they are black, white, yellow or brown. Long as they can put the ball in the basket and play great D and represent our team with pride I personally could care less where they come from.

[LarBrd33]

Saw a podcast recently where they asked someone to give actual reasons Anthony Davis wouldn't consider Boston. Fact is, there aren't a lot of reasons. The two main things Davis wants is to play for a winner (his team sucks) and to be relevant (they were offended he didn't even get voted as an all-star starter and his team can't even fill their arena for home games)...

Boston checks ALL of the boxes. Potential to play for a winner, great supporting cast (if Kyrie stays), great ownership group, elite management, great coach, one of the 5 most relevant franchises in the NBA... it's a no-brainer.

The only two reasons the podcaster could come up with.

1 - Boston is cold

2 - Some still think Boston is racist

I was surprised this was still a narrative... that Boston is "racist" and that black players don't want to play here. That seems lazy and cheap. That said, I've spent quite a bit of time looking at the fan community turning on Kyrie Irving based on out-of-context quotes and I have to say (though certainly not in all instances), I've frequently seen an element of racism in the Kyrie hate. In some instances, blatant racism. It's disgusted me seeing what some Celtic fans have said. But to be honest, that level of racism I was seeing isn't exclusive to Boston. It's still a problem all over the Country. I saw similar takes on Carmelo Anthony when he played on the Knicks, for instance. There are crappy people everywhere.

That said, I had a private conversation with a black fan a couple days ago who actually made this exact argument - that Hayward gets favorable treatment, because he's white.  He pointed out that Hayward gets a ridiculous amount of love for "having done absolutely nothing".  I couldn't discount it entirely, but I honestly feel like the reason Hayward gets so much love is mainly because he's coming off a catastrophic injury where his foot fell off.  We all just want to see him get healthy.  And certain, there's fans out there who have hated on Hayward.  You need only listen to my podcast with KG Living Legend to hear a fan ranting about what a dumpsterfire Hayward's season has been.  In the recent Jackie Mac article, Hayward admitted that he's actually had to avoid social media and start seeing a mental health counselor because of some of the negativity he's had to deal with.  He's definitely getting his share of hate.   But yeah... maybe he also gets a bit of a pass for some of his failures that fans wouldn't give a guy like Kyrie.

Again, as a white dude who lives in Seattle, my perspective on this is limited.  I've seen racism from Celtic fans.  It's bothered me.  Whether or not that makes the label of Boston being "racist" when compared to other cities - I don't know.  It's a problem everywhere.

[rollie mass]

Red Auerbach broke the color barrier,the Cetics even had Bill Russell as a player coach -Red also exploited the GM's prejudice against white players .And he drafted Cowens, Havlicek Danny,McHale and Bird.

I think Kyrie being as flighty as he is with how much confusion and erratic leadership was alienating. I think he is fun except when he plays those leave games.Everybody loved Isaiah till back up the Brink's truck and and started preparing for him to not get the max-

I had real trouble watching Hayward do his best Kelly O while losing and team morale in the dumpster.You could see Hayward fundamentally was first of all a very good basketball player but not ever a savant like Kyrie.
Rather than criticize, i stopped watching.It got to if a player doesn't want to play for Celtics ,doesn't want to play defense or doesn't want to be a Celtic team player -trade them and get something back.

This trade deadline was another nightmare and morale breaker-Durant and Kyrie to Knicks ,if the Celts don't get Davis, Kyrie is gone then don't trade Rozier now.   Danny just stood resolutely pat.
The backlash of Kyrie making public his apology to Lebron and almost throwing his young guys under the bus.Toxic,no fun,youth against vets going to lose Tatum ,Brown and maybe Smart for a AD rental.

The whole time Brad was steadfast in getting Hayward his minutes.This was set in stone .

Hayward was showing some flashes then a sprained ankle that set him and the team back after All Star break.Even Semi wake the F up.
Then Hayward got an aggressive 30 vs Warriors ,a game winner on a back to back and another win.

All my favorite players are black going back to Russell days with the exception of Cowens,Havilcek,McHale and Bird -Russel,Sam Jones early favorites,then Jo Jo all the way to Evan Turner.

[rollie mass]

mistake

[Roy H.]

You could see Hayward fundamentally was first of all a very good basketball player but not ever a savant like Kyrie.

I think that pre-injury, they were both pretty equally skilled.  If anything, Hayward was regarded as a better all-around player because he contributes on the defensive end.  He doesn't have an elite skill like Kyrie's dribbling, but they were definitely on the same tier as a player, ranked in the 15th to 20th range.

[nickagneta]

I am not on Instagram, Twitter, or Snapchat. We see a bunch of negativity towards some Celtics right here on CelticsStrong, a Celtic fan website. I can not imagine the crap people post on a player's fan profile on Facebook(which I am on) and the other social media sites available today.

We see some negative stuff through mainstream sports media. I can not even fathom the stuff these guys see on their personal fan accounts with no filter there like we have here with mods.

[indeedproceed]

Dan Feldmen, the writer who wrote the race article, had a similarly bad article about the Lakers: https://nba.nbcsports.com/2019/03/11/report-lakers-coaching-staff-urged-magic-johnson-to-re-sign-brook-lopez-and-julius-randle/

He's just like..not very good.

[jpd985]

Dan Feldmen, the writer who wrote the race article, had a similarly bad article about the Lakers: https://nba.nbcsports.com/2019/03/11/report-lakers-coaching-staff-urged-magic-johnson-to-re-sign-brook-lopez-and-julius-randle/

He's just like..not very good.

Sounds like he is race baiting for clicks.

[RJ87]

Saw a podcast recently where they asked someone to give actual reasons Anthony Davis wouldn't consider Boston. Fact is, there aren't a lot of reasons. The two main things Davis wants is to play for a winner (his team sucks) and to be relevant (they were offended he didn't even get voted as an all-star starter and his team can't even fill their arena for home games)...

Boston checks ALL of the boxes. Potential to play for a winner, great supporting cast (if Kyrie stays), great ownership group, elite management, great coach, one of the 5 most relevant franchises in the NBA... it's a no-brainer.

The only two reasons the podcaster could come up with.

1 - Boston is cold

2 - Some still think Boston is racist

I was surprised this was still a narrative... that Boston is "racist" and that black players don't want to play here. That seems lazy and cheap. That said, I've spent quite a bit of time looking at the fan community turning on Kyrie Irving based on out-of-context quotes and I have to say (though certainly not in all instances), I've frequently seen an element of racism in the Kyrie hate. In some instances, blatant racism. It's disgusted me seeing what some Celtic fans have said. But to be honest, that level of racism I was seeing isn't exclusive to Boston. It's still a problem all over the Country. I saw similar takes on Carmelo Anthony when he played on the Knicks, for instance. There are crappy people everywhere.

That said, I had a private conversation with a black fan a couple days ago who actually made this exact argument - that Hayward gets favorable treatment, because he's white.  He pointed out that Hayward gets a ridiculous amount of love for "having done absolutely nothing".  I couldn't discount it entirely, but I honestly feel like the reason Hayward gets so much love is mainly because he's coming off a catastrophic injury where his foot fell off. We all just want to see him get healthy.  And certain, there's fans out there who have hated on Hayward.  You need only listen to my podcast with KG Living Legend to hear a fan ranting about what a dumpsterfire Hayward's season has been.  In the recent Jackie Mac article, Hayward admitted that he's actually had to avoid social media and start seeing a mental health counselor because of some of the negativity he's had to deal with.  He's definitely getting his share of hate.   But yeah... maybe he also gets a bit of a pass for some of his failures that fans wouldn't give a guy like Kyrie.

Again, as a white dude who lives in Seattle, my perspective on this is limited.  I've seen racism from Celtic fans.  It's bothered me.  Whether or not that makes the label of Boston being "racist" when compared to other cities - I don't know.  It's a problem everywhere.

I do wonder if you switch their circumstances, would the perception of each player be the same? I have an inkling it wouldn't. While Gordon does get some criticism, he's mostly gone unscathed. For example: people have called out Kyrie for some of the locker room issues and his leadership methods, but Gordon gets a pass. Yes, he is coming back from injury but he still has All-Star experience, has still been in the league longer than a big chuck of our roster, and he's still our highest paid player. Aside from Kyrie, players themselves have attributed the leadership of this team to Al and Smart, even Morris at times. His on-court production does deserve understanding, but his off-court leadership - or rather, his complete lack thereof - deserves more criticism than it's gotten. . I think a big aspect of him being able to avoid that, especially considering the hot take culture that envelopes Boston sports, is because he's a white player.

[slamtheking]

Saw a podcast recently where they asked someone to give actual reasons Anthony Davis wouldn't consider Boston. Fact is, there aren't a lot of reasons. The two main things Davis wants is to play for a winner (his team sucks) and to be relevant (they were offended he didn't even get voted as an all-star starter and his team can't even fill their arena for home games)...

Boston checks ALL of the boxes. Potential to play for a winner, great supporting cast (if Kyrie stays), great ownership group, elite management, great coach, one of the 5 most relevant franchises in the NBA... it's a no-brainer.

The only two reasons the podcaster could come up with.

1 - Boston is cold

2 - Some still think Boston is racist

I was surprised this was still a narrative... that Boston is "racist" and that black players don't want to play here. That seems lazy and cheap. That said, I've spent quite a bit of time looking at the fan community turning on Kyrie Irving based on out-of-context quotes and I have to say (though certainly not in all instances), I've frequently seen an element of racism in the Kyrie hate. In some instances, blatant racism. It's disgusted me seeing what some Celtic fans have said. But to be honest, that level of racism I was seeing isn't exclusive to Boston. It's still a problem all over the Country. I saw similar takes on Carmelo Anthony when he played on the Knicks, for instance. There are crappy people everywhere.

That said, I had a private conversation with a black fan a couple days ago who actually made this exact argument - that Hayward gets favorable treatment, because he's white.  He pointed out that Hayward gets a ridiculous amount of love for "having done absolutely nothing".  I couldn't discount it entirely, but I honestly feel like the reason Hayward gets so much love is mainly because he's coming off a catastrophic injury where his foot fell off. We all just want to see him get healthy.  And certain, there's fans out there who have hated on Hayward.  You need only listen to my podcast with KG Living Legend to hear a fan ranting about what a dumpsterfire Hayward's season has been.  In the recent Jackie Mac article, Hayward admitted that he's actually had to avoid social media and start seeing a mental health counselor because of some of the negativity he's had to deal with.  He's definitely getting his share of hate.   But yeah... maybe he also gets a bit of a pass for some of his failures that fans wouldn't give a guy like Kyrie.

Again, as a white dude who lives in Seattle, my perspective on this is limited.  I've seen racism from Celtic fans.  It's bothered me.  Whether or not that makes the label of Boston being "racist" when compared to other cities - I don't know.  It's a problem everywhere.

I do wonder if you switch their circumstances, would the perception of each player be the same? I have an inkling it wouldn't. While Gordon does get some criticism, he's mostly gone unscathed. For example: people have called out Kyrie for some of the locker room issues and his leadership methods, but Gordon gets a pass. Yes, he is coming back from injury but he still has All-Star experience, has still been in the league longer than a big chuck of our roster, and he's still our highest paid player. Aside from Kyrie, players themselves have attributed the leadership of this team to Al and Smart, even Morris at times. His on-court production does deserve understanding, but his off-court leadership - or rather, his complete lack thereof - deserves more criticism than it's gotten. . I think a big aspect of him being able to avoid that, especially considering the hot take culture that envelopes Boston sports, is because he's a white player.

hogwash.  he hasn't gone unscathed here.  he may have gotten a bit of a pass at the start of the season but has the year has progressed that pass has disappeared.  skin color has nothing to do with his treatment.  He's being taken to task for his passive play and lack of productivity for what he makes.

his role in leading the lockerroom isn't significant at this point nor should it be in light of the fact we have players who've been here longer and/or been much more productive.  in short, he should be working on improving his game before he should be trying to lead this team. 

[nickagneta]

Saw a podcast recently where they asked someone to give actual reasons Anthony Davis wouldn't consider Boston. Fact is, there aren't a lot of reasons. The two main things Davis wants is to play for a winner (his team sucks) and to be relevant (they were offended he didn't even get voted as an all-star starter and his team can't even fill their arena for home games)...

Boston checks ALL of the boxes. Potential to play for a winner, great supporting cast (if Kyrie stays), great ownership group, elite management, great coach, one of the 5 most relevant franchises in the NBA... it's a no-brainer.

The only two reasons the podcaster could come up with.

1 - Boston is cold

2 - Some still think Boston is racist

I was surprised this was still a narrative... that Boston is "racist" and that black players don't want to play here. That seems lazy and cheap. That said, I've spent quite a bit of time looking at the fan community turning on Kyrie Irving based on out-of-context quotes and I have to say (though certainly not in all instances), I've frequently seen an element of racism in the Kyrie hate. In some instances, blatant racism. It's disgusted me seeing what some Celtic fans have said. But to be honest, that level of racism I was seeing isn't exclusive to Boston. It's still a problem all over the Country. I saw similar takes on Carmelo Anthony when he played on the Knicks, for instance. There are crappy people everywhere.

That said, I had a private conversation with a black fan a couple days ago who actually made this exact argument - that Hayward gets favorable treatment, because he's white.  He pointed out that Hayward gets a ridiculous amount of love for "having done absolutely nothing".  I couldn't discount it entirely, but I honestly feel like the reason Hayward gets so much love is mainly because he's coming off a catastrophic injury where his foot fell off. We all just want to see him get healthy.  And certain, there's fans out there who have hated on Hayward.  You need only listen to my podcast with KG Living Legend to hear a fan ranting about what a dumpsterfire Hayward's season has been.  In the recent Jackie Mac article, Hayward admitted that he's actually had to avoid social media and start seeing a mental health counselor because of some of the negativity he's had to deal with.  He's definitely getting his share of hate.   But yeah... maybe he also gets a bit of a pass for some of his failures that fans wouldn't give a guy like Kyrie.

Again, as a white dude who lives in Seattle, my perspective on this is limited.  I've seen racism from Celtic fans.  It's bothered me.  Whether or not that makes the label of Boston being "racist" when compared to other cities - I don't know.  It's a problem everywhere.

I do wonder if you switch their circumstances, would the perception of each player be the same? I have an inkling it wouldn't. While Gordon does get some criticism, he's mostly gone unscathed. For example: people have called out Kyrie for some of the locker room issues and his leadership methods, but Gordon gets a pass. Yes, he is coming back from injury but he still has All-Star experience, has still been in the league longer than a big chuck of our roster, and he's still our highest paid player. Aside from Kyrie, players themselves have attributed the leadership of this team to Al and Smart, even Morris at times. His on-court production does deserve understanding, but his off-court leadership - or rather, his complete lack thereof - deserves more criticism than it's gotten. . I think a big aspect of him being able to avoid that, especially considering the hot take culture that envelopes Boston sports, is because he's a white player.

hogwash.  he hasn't gone unscathed here.  he may have gotten a bit of a pass at the start of the season but has the year has progressed that pass has disappeared.  skin color has nothing to do with his treatment.  He's being taken to task for his passive play and lack of productivity for what he makes.

his role in leading the lockerroom isn't significant at this point nor should it be in light of the fact we have players who've been here longer and/or been much more productive.  in short, he should be working on improving his game before he should be trying to lead this team.

If Hayward were here a while then got his contract then got injured, I would expect more of a leadership role. But he is basically brand new to this team and Brad's system this year. He shouldn't be trying to lead anyone. Not at this point. Maybe after a healthy year or so, but not now.

[Triplenickle]

*ponders*

"So THIS is why they're always trying to trade the Black man"

And never the White man.

We're being hoodwinked...bamboozled...and led astray

I have a dream that aaaaaaall the black players will be seen for their positives...and not aaaaaaaaall their negatives

[slamtheking]

Saw a podcast recently where they asked someone to give actual reasons Anthony Davis wouldn't consider Boston. Fact is, there aren't a lot of reasons. The two main things Davis wants is to play for a winner (his team sucks) and to be relevant (they were offended he didn't even get voted as an all-star starter and his team can't even fill their arena for home games)...

Boston checks ALL of the boxes. Potential to play for a winner, great supporting cast (if Kyrie stays), great ownership group, elite management, great coach, one of the 5 most relevant franchises in the NBA... it's a no-brainer.

The only two reasons the podcaster could come up with.

1 - Boston is cold

2 - Some still think Boston is racist

I was surprised this was still a narrative... that Boston is "racist" and that black players don't want to play here. That seems lazy and cheap. That said, I've spent quite a bit of time looking at the fan community turning on Kyrie Irving based on out-of-context quotes and I have to say (though certainly not in all instances), I've frequently seen an element of racism in the Kyrie hate. In some instances, blatant racism. It's disgusted me seeing what some Celtic fans have said. But to be honest, that level of racism I was seeing isn't exclusive to Boston. It's still a problem all over the Country. I saw similar takes on Carmelo Anthony when he played on the Knicks, for instance. There are crappy people everywhere.

That said, I had a private conversation with a black fan a couple days ago who actually made this exact argument - that Hayward gets favorable treatment, because he's white.  He pointed out that Hayward gets a ridiculous amount of love for "having done absolutely nothing".  I couldn't discount it entirely, but I honestly feel like the reason Hayward gets so much love is mainly because he's coming off a catastrophic injury where his foot fell off. We all just want to see him get healthy.  And certain, there's fans out there who have hated on Hayward.  You need only listen to my podcast with KG Living Legend to hear a fan ranting about what a dumpsterfire Hayward's season has been.  In the recent Jackie Mac article, Hayward admitted that he's actually had to avoid social media and start seeing a mental health counselor because of some of the negativity he's had to deal with.  He's definitely getting his share of hate.   But yeah... maybe he also gets a bit of a pass for some of his failures that fans wouldn't give a guy like Kyrie.

Again, as a white dude who lives in Seattle, my perspective on this is limited.  I've seen racism from Celtic fans.  It's bothered me.  Whether or not that makes the label of Boston being "racist" when compared to other cities - I don't know.  It's a problem everywhere.

I do wonder if you switch their circumstances, would the perception of each player be the same? I have an inkling it wouldn't. While Gordon does get some criticism, he's mostly gone unscathed. For example: people have called out Kyrie for some of the locker room issues and his leadership methods, but Gordon gets a pass. Yes, he is coming back from injury but he still has All-Star experience, has still been in the league longer than a big chuck of our roster, and he's still our highest paid player. Aside from Kyrie, players themselves have attributed the leadership of this team to Al and Smart, even Morris at times. His on-court production does deserve understanding, but his off-court leadership - or rather, his complete lack thereof - deserves more criticism than it's gotten. . I think a big aspect of him being able to avoid that, especially considering the hot take culture that envelopes Boston sports, is because he's a white player.

hogwash.  he hasn't gone unscathed here.  he may have gotten a bit of a pass at the start of the season but has the year has progressed that pass has disappeared.  skin color has nothing to do with his treatment.  He's being taken to task for his passive play and lack of productivity for what he makes.

his role in leading the lockerroom isn't significant at this point nor should it be in light of the fact we have players who've been here longer and/or been much more productive.  in short, he should be working on improving his game before he should be trying to lead this team.

If Hayward were here a while then got his contract then got injured, I would expect more of a leadership role. But he is basically brand new to this team and Brad's system this year. He shouldn't be trying to lead anyone. Not at this point. Maybe after a healthy year or so, but not now.

pretty much my point.