Author Topic: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy  (Read 12065 times)

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Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #15 on: January 23, 2019, 10:25:59 AM »

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It's weird to me how people don't see the "unfairness" in tossing a coin for OT possession. Team on offense can afford to fail to score a touchdown and keep playing, but the defense can't afford to fail in stopping a touchdown. This clearly favors the team on offense. The fact that the benefit of this format hinges on a artificially ~randomized event makes the fortunes heading into a sudden death situation uneven.

I would rather the NFL adopt the old XFL thing where two dudes at opposite ends of the field run toward the ball in the middle (football equivalent of a jump ball). The guy who gets it wins the possession for his team. At least there is skill involved by a member of the teams. Not a flip of a coin, which has nothing to do with the game of football.

Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #16 on: January 23, 2019, 10:37:18 AM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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In the playoffs at least just make OT a full quarter, whoever's up at the end wins. If it's still tied play another. This is probably too grueling for regular season OTs but it's a fair way to handle the playoffs. Make the quarter 10 minutes if it's too harsh.

Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #17 on: January 23, 2019, 10:44:28 AM »

Offline ederson

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It's weird to me how people don't see the "unfairness" in tossing a coin for OT possession. Team on offense can afford to fail to score a touchdown and keep playing, but the defense can't afford to fail in stopping a touchdown. This clearly favors the team on offense. The fact that the benefit of this format hinges on a artificially ~randomized event makes the fortunes heading into a sudden death situation uneven.

It is one of the most unfair rules i've seen (if not the most unfair)

At least the team on defence should have the opportunity to try to score . For example two offenses. After the second the score is tied then again the same. Like the penalties in soccer after the first 5. 

Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #18 on: January 23, 2019, 10:50:43 AM »

Offline Moranis

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I think they should just give each team a possession and make it sudden death after that (or end it if a team is winning after 1 possession), at least for playoff games.  Maybe leave the regular season alone

There are other ways to make changes though.

- You could keep the same rule, but only end the game if they score 8 points instead of just the 6 for the TD.  That would force a team to make a decision on going for 2 and the automatic win or kicking the extra point and letting the other team get the ball.  that would add a great deal of intrigue

- You could make a rule that each team possesses the ball, but the 2nd team only gets as much time as the first team actually uses (if they score, if they don't score there is no time restriction).  So if a team returns the kick for a TD, the 2nd team only gets the 15 seconds or whatever.  If the 1st team gets a long first play and ends up in FG range after 30 seconds, they could elect to kick the FG (and give the other team like 35 seconds) or they could try for the TD and take more time off the clock giving the other team more time.  That would add some intrigue and strategy. 

- they could do something similar to the college system.  I'm not a huge fan of that, but maybe instead of the 25, they start at the 40 or something.  Abbreviates the game, but gives both teams an actual shot at offense.
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Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #19 on: January 23, 2019, 10:54:45 AM »

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I just don't see the OT thing to be a pressing issue.  Is it perfect?  No.   But you have the opportunity to get a stop on defense.  Heck, limit them to a FG and you're still playing and giving your offense a chance to put the game away.   Plus, you already had 60 minutes.  It's also not guaranteed that the team calling the coin toss actually wins it.    If they want to change it, fine.  If they want to keep it the way it is, I don't see a problem with it. 

Like I mentioned earlier, if the Chiefs had won under the same circumstances, is there a huge national debate about this right now?   Where was this outrage after the '14 NFC title game?


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Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #20 on: January 23, 2019, 11:52:16 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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I just don't see the OT thing to be a pressing issue.  Is it perfect?  No.   But you have the opportunity to get a stop on defense.  Heck, limit them to a FG and you're still playing and giving your offense a chance to put the game away.   Plus, you already had 60 minutes.  It's also not guaranteed that the team calling the coin toss actually wins it.    If they want to change it, fine.  If they want to keep it the way it is, I don't see a problem with it. 

Like I mentioned earlier, if the Chiefs had won under the same circumstances, is there a huge national debate about this right now?   Where was this outrage after the '14 NFC title game?

Thats like sàying in basketball next bucket wins

The other poster is right

Its not fair for the defense

Another interesting idea was

Whoever has the ball at the end of the 4th gets to continue with possession at the start of OT ( down/yards leftoff)

No coin toss involved. Still current sudden death rules

Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #21 on: January 23, 2019, 11:58:04 AM »

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I just don't see the OT thing to be a pressing issue.  Is it perfect?  No.   But you have the opportunity to get a stop on defense.  Heck, limit them to a FG and you're still playing and giving your offense a chance to put the game away.   Plus, you already had 60 minutes.  It's also not guaranteed that the team calling the coin toss actually wins it.    If they want to change it, fine.  If they want to keep it the way it is, I don't see a problem with it. 

Like I mentioned earlier, if the Chiefs had won under the same circumstances, is there a huge national debate about this right now?   Where was this outrage after the '14 NFC title game?

Thats like sàying in basketball next bucket wins

The other poster is right

Its not fair for the defense

Another interesting idea was

Whoever has the ball at the end of the 4th gets to continue with possession at the start of OT

No coin toss involved. Still current sudden death rules

"Next basket wins" is sudden death.  What the NFL currently has is a modified sudden death so its not the same.   You kick a FG, its points but your opponent has a chance to tie or beat you.  The game carries on.

What's not fair about it for the defense?


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Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #22 on: January 23, 2019, 11:58:23 AM »

Offline Tr1boy

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The Pats havent loss 3 coin flips in a row now

If Pats lost on Sunday without Brady getting a chance in OT

I bet many would change their stance (leave it the way it is)

Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #23 on: January 23, 2019, 12:03:54 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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How about a field goal shootout , kinda like the penalty kicks in soccer overtime?

Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #24 on: January 23, 2019, 12:06:08 PM »

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How about a field goal shootout , kinda like the penalty kicks in soccer overtime?

Personally, I'd find that boring as heck.


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Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #25 on: January 23, 2019, 12:12:05 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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I would say each team gets one offensive possession, and then after that if it's still tied, go to the college OT format.

Each team starts on the 25 yard line or whatever, field goals not an option, TD only. 
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Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #26 on: January 23, 2019, 12:46:58 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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I think they should just give each team a possession and make it sudden death after that (or end it if a team is winning after 1 possession), at least for playoff games.  Maybe leave the regular season alone

There are other ways to make changes though.

- You could keep the same rule, but only end the game if they score 8 points instead of just the 6 for the TD.  That would force a team to make a decision on going for 2 and the automatic win or kicking the extra point and letting the other team get the ball.  that would add a great deal of intrigue

- You could make a rule that each team possesses the ball, but the 2nd team only gets as much time as the first team actually uses (if they score, if they don't score there is no time restriction).  So if a team returns the kick for a TD, the 2nd team only gets the 15 seconds or whatever.  If the 1st team gets a long first play and ends up in FG range after 30 seconds, they could elect to kick the FG (and give the other team like 35 seconds) or they could try for the TD and take more time off the clock giving the other team more time.  That would add some intrigue and strategy. 

- they could do something similar to the college system.  I'm not a huge fan of that, but maybe instead of the 25, they start at the 40 or something.  Abbreviates the game, but gives both teams an actual shot at offense.

I like this idea. Also I will add that the coin toss has become more unfair over time because the league has tweaked the rules repeatedly to help the offense and improve scoring (and scoring and yardage are definitely way up). So it is a easier for a team to win the toss and just score a touchdown than it was 20 years ago increasing the unfairness of it all. How confident are the people on here that if the Pats had lost the coin toss we would have been able to stop them from getting a td on the first drive? Considering we couldn't stop them from going 45 yards in like 25 seconds i am pretty doubtful.

Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #27 on: January 23, 2019, 12:58:08 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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Yes, change the OT rule so that both teams are guaranteed to touch the ball.

Practically, almost all pass interference calls are judgment calls. Officials almost never miss the blatant stuff. If replay was added, I can see lots of challenges of ticky tack plays, mutual hand-fighting, etc.  I guess if it’s only a booth-initiated challenge in the last two minutes, will only clearly wrong plays to be overturned. But, I think it would just lead to additional controversy.


I like the idea of some type of mechanism that would let the booth automatically initiate a review of a major call or non-call. 

I agree that giving coaches challenges on penalties would bog the game down too much.  All of the replay already makes the games super super long.

This

You keep the number of challenges the same or maybe add one more.   It's really not gonna add much time.

You think a coach is gonna waste a challenge on a subjective first down holding call in the 2nd quarter?

You're not opening the door up to unlimited challenges here.  Coaches are still going to have to be very careful how they manage their challenges.

I agree with this take.  Just keep the number of challenges the same.  You still run the risk of losing a timeout if the challenge fails.   And if the play starts as a non-call, you have the burden of overturning that.  So I don't believe coaches would ask for a review except in the most egregious, obvious cases.

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Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #28 on: January 23, 2019, 01:03:04 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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I will say I'm more sympathetic than I used to be towards the argument that the OT rules aren't entirely fair, given the NFL has clearly made offense the #1 priority and seems to consider defense more of a nuisance than a legit part of the game.  If you're going to make offense the primary driver of winning games, it is a bit ridiculous to set up a system where the luck of a coin toss has such an outsized impact.

Personally, I'm becoming more and more put off by the way football is played now, though, anyways.  I find that I'm just not that interested anymore in watching games that don't involve my team.  What we're watching today isn't the way football was meant to be played.

Re: NFL playoffs - Replay and OT controversy
« Reply #29 on: January 23, 2019, 01:08:23 PM »

Offline Moranis

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I think they should just give each team a possession and make it sudden death after that (or end it if a team is winning after 1 possession), at least for playoff games.  Maybe leave the regular season alone

There are other ways to make changes though.

- You could keep the same rule, but only end the game if they score 8 points instead of just the 6 for the TD.  That would force a team to make a decision on going for 2 and the automatic win or kicking the extra point and letting the other team get the ball.  that would add a great deal of intrigue

- You could make a rule that each team possesses the ball, but the 2nd team only gets as much time as the first team actually uses (if they score, if they don't score there is no time restriction).  So if a team returns the kick for a TD, the 2nd team only gets the 15 seconds or whatever.  If the 1st team gets a long first play and ends up in FG range after 30 seconds, they could elect to kick the FG (and give the other team like 35 seconds) or they could try for the TD and take more time off the clock giving the other team more time.  That would add some intrigue and strategy. 

- they could do something similar to the college system.  I'm not a huge fan of that, but maybe instead of the 25, they start at the 40 or something.  Abbreviates the game, but gives both teams an actual shot at offense.

I like this idea. Also I will add that the coin toss has become more unfair over time because the league has tweaked the rules repeatedly to help the offense and improve scoring (and scoring and yardage are definitely way up). So it is a easier for a team to win the toss and just score a touchdown than it was 20 years ago increasing the unfairness of it all. How confident are the people on here that if the Pats had lost the coin toss we would have been able to stop them from getting a td on the first drive? Considering we couldn't stop them from going 45 yards in like 25 seconds i am pretty doubtful.
Yeah the bolded one is what I would do.  If you miss the 2 point conversion then the other team can score, kick an extra point, and win.  Really adds some intrigue and a real decision making process for the team that scores that first TD.  If it is still tied after that, then you just sudden death. 
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