Author Topic: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)  (Read 366765 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1575 on: December 17, 2018, 05:22:35 AM »

Offline tazzmaniac

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8113
  • Tommy Points: 549
Simmons had 21/14/11 in just 31 mins today.  Doesn't seem affected by Butler's arrival.

Simmons has always put up good numbers. The real question for him is if he can be effective against the elite teams like us or the raptors. Personally I think he should be moved to power forward if he is never going to shoot.
Simmons can put up big regular season numbers. Probably will his whole career. But if he can't shoot from outside, in a 7 game series it's easy to game plan against him and really hurt his team's chances of success

I 100% agree and I think Brett brown gives him a pass on not improving his shooting. I don’t think he will make the all star team this year either, but many have already appointed him a suoerstar
Do you guys not consider Giannis an all-star either? 

Who is making an all-star team over Ben Simmons this year?  He's averaging 16 points, 9 rebounds, 8 assists and 1.5 steals with 57% shooting.   Also, lock this thread.
Too bad that he shrinks in the playoffs.
Giannis?  Different coach this year.  We'll see how he does.  Most blame the horrible coaching for how the Bucks underachieved in the playoffs last year.
I meant Simmons.
Eh... He was a rookie last season and averaged 18 points, 11 rebounds, 9 assists and 2.4 steals in the first round over Miami.  Boston played him tough in Round 2 and Philly underachieved in general, but it seems kind of silly to suggest he's a career playoff choker over his first ever trip to the playoffs.
I don't think he is a choker, he is determined kind of guy, which I like.
This is a skill thing, offensive versatility.
He is really effective in transition.
Once the game slows down in the playoffs and teams load up on his drives he becomes ineffective and basically cramps his team's halfcourt offense. And that is the majority of his team's offense where he is the playmaker. Wouldn't you agree that this is sub-optimal, to say the least? A playmaker slowing his team's offense down.

I don't dig traditional stats much without the whole context.
TDs mean little to me. For example; Fultz is the youngest ever to achieve one.
What did it mean long term? Nothing.
He is looking for another team and for a no.1. pick.
Nobody wants to give an asset of true value for him and he is 20.
Russell is a TD god, but he is the 2nd best player on his team that regularly bounces in the 1st round.

Versatility and no critical weaknesses are the name of the game to me.
Last season was Simmons first playing PG.  His talent showed but so did his limitations.  The Sixers were last in the league in pick and rolls because of Simmons.  That is really a travesty when you have Embiid.  Fultz in his short stint ran better pick and rolls with than Simmons does.  Maybe after Rondo finishes mentoring Ball this season he can work with Simmons next season. 

Simmons lack of just shooting, not just from 3 but anywhere, makes me question his drive and work ethic.  Is his ego too fragile?  Just what was he doing this offseason.  He doesn't need to be a good shooter or even an average one.  Plenty of PGs do quite well with below average shooting. 

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1576 on: December 17, 2018, 06:57:07 AM »

Offline nickagneta

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 48120
  • Tommy Points: 8794
  • President of Jaylen Brown Fan Club
Simmons this year has actually regressed in his outside shooting. Last year he took 79% of his shots from inside 10 feet. In last year's playoffs that went to 86%. This season it's at a tick over 90%. He isn't even trying to take shots outside of ten feet. Out of 1459 shots he has taken in his career, playoffs included, he has taken 12 three pointers and made none. This year he has not hit a hot from outside of 16 feet.

Think about that. Out of 336 shots so far this year he hasn't hit one from outside 16 feet. That makes game planning for him and the Philly offense in a 7 game series so easy

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1577 on: December 17, 2018, 07:16:46 AM »

Offline Androslav

  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2983
  • Tommy Points: 528
Simmons this year has actually regressed in his outside shooting. Last year he took 79% of his shots from inside 10 feet. In last year's playoffs that went to 86%. This season it's at a tick over 90%. He isn't even trying to take shots outside of ten feet. Out of 1459 shots he has taken in his career, playoffs included, he has taken 12 three pointers and made none. This year he has not hit a hot from outside of 16 feet.

Think about that. Out of 336 shots so far this year he hasn't hit one from outside 16 feet. That makes game planning for him and the Philly offense in a 7 game series so easy
Exactly.
Critical weakness = opponents deal double damage in playoff series.
"The joy of the balling under the rims."

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1578 on: December 17, 2018, 07:24:46 AM »

Offline Androslav

  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2983
  • Tommy Points: 528
Philly has a 115 Def Rtg when Embiid isn't on the floor. Garbage time excluded. Yikes! Cleveland has 115 Def Rtg.
Considering that he is a big dude (gets tired more easily) and that he hasn't been conditioned particularly well in his career, there will be some tough stretches in the playoffs trying to defend.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2018, 08:14:26 AM by Androslav »
"The joy of the balling under the rims."

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1579 on: December 17, 2018, 08:22:43 AM »

Offline LarBrd33

  • Robert Parish
  • *********************
  • Posts: 21238
  • Tommy Points: 2016
Eh, if Simmons' shooting is an issue they can just flip him for some other all-star. 

Pointless to talk about it.  That team is stacked.  Lock the thread.  It's over.

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1580 on: December 17, 2018, 08:33:58 AM »

Offline ederson

  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2896
  • Tommy Points: 279
Eh, if Simmons' shooting is an issue they can just flip him for some other all-star. 

Pointless to talk about it.  That team is stacked.  Lock the thread.  It's over.

Stacked ????? a six men deep team (and i am generous) is stacked ???


Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1581 on: December 17, 2018, 08:40:09 AM »

Offline Androslav

  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2983
  • Tommy Points: 528
Eh, if Simmons' shooting is an issue they can just flip him for some other all-star. 

Pointless to talk about it.  That team is stacked.  Lock the thread.  It's over.

Stacked ????? a six men deep team (and i am generous) is stacked ???
True, I stopped at the:
"if Simmons' shooting is an issue they can just flip him for some other all-star." 
"The joy of the balling under the rims."

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1582 on: December 17, 2018, 09:15:26 AM »

Offline 10610786d

  • Al Horford
  • Posts: 404
  • Tommy Points: 27
Simmons this year has actually regressed in his outside shooting. Last year he took 79% of his shots from inside 10 feet. In last year's playoffs that went to 86%. This season it's at a tick over 90%. He isn't even trying to take shots outside of ten feet. Out of 1459 shots he has taken in his career, playoffs included, he has taken 12 three pointers and made none. This year he has not hit a hot from outside of 16 feet.

Think about that. Out of 336 shots so far this year he hasn't hit one from outside 16 feet. That makes game planning for him and the Philly offense in a 7 game series so easy

How does he compare to Giannis then.

Guess Simmons just isn't freakish enough to justify having zero jumpshot.

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1583 on: December 17, 2018, 09:20:30 AM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

  • Paul Silas
  • ******
  • Posts: 6043
  • Tommy Points: 766
There are still a ton of question marks about this team moving forward.

Butler will be 30 under his next contract.
Embiid's health
Do the Sixers have the cajones to trade a generational talent like Simmons because his shooting doesn't fit with Butler and Embiid?
Can the Sixers develop young talent? Especially without the ability to force feed shots?
Is Brown a good coach?
Will Reddick resign?
Can they get a role player of value for Fultz?

They've generally done a nice job building their team, but they've made several mistakes that they have to recover from: 1) misses on drafting Okafor, Noel, and Fultz, 2) not only missing on Fultz, but trading an extra asset for him, 3) No QO for Korkmaz, who has started to look like an NBA player in stretches.

If we're honest, they still are in one of the best situations of any NBA franchise. Still, they are not a given.

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1584 on: December 17, 2018, 10:17:59 AM »

Offline Androslav

  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2983
  • Tommy Points: 528
The trade between Phoenix and Philly showed that Kelly Oubre has much higher trade value then Fultz. Keep on mind that Phoenix actually wants young players, especially point guards.

Seems to me that Philly will once again wait their asset value to deprecate then do a deal. (Noel, Okafor)
"The joy of the balling under the rims."

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1585 on: December 17, 2018, 10:30:16 AM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

  • Paul Silas
  • ******
  • Posts: 6043
  • Tommy Points: 766
The trade between Phoenix and Philly showed that Kelly Oubre has much higher trade value then Fultz. Keep on mind that Phoenix actually wants young players, especially point guards.

Seems to me that Philly will once again wait their asset value to deprecate then do a deal. (Noel, Okafor)

This is a good point. I guarantee that Ariza and Daniels was on the table for Fultz and Chandler.

Ariza would help the Sixers a lot, and he is an expiring, which gives them the flexibility this off-season they want. Plus, Daniels is a shooter that could help them.

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1586 on: December 17, 2018, 10:36:12 AM »

Offline nickagneta

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 48120
  • Tommy Points: 8794
  • President of Jaylen Brown Fan Club
Simmons this year has actually regressed in his outside shooting. Last year he took 79% of his shots from inside 10 feet. In last year's playoffs that went to 86%. This season it's at a tick over 90%. He isn't even trying to take shots outside of ten feet. Out of 1459 shots he has taken in his career, playoffs included, he has taken 12 three pointers and made none. This year he has not hit a hot from outside of 16 feet.

Think about that. Out of 336 shots so far this year he hasn't hit one from outside 16 feet. That makes game planning for him and the Philly offense in a 7 game series so easy

How does he compare to Giannis then.

Guess Simmons just isn't freakish enough to justify having zero jumpshot.
Giannis, for his career has these percentages of shots taken within 10 feet
57.4%
68.4%
68.9%
64.5%
61.7%
73.7%

So he averages about 65% of his shots from within 10 feet on any given year, though this year he is at his career highest of 73.7%. Lots of season still to play so that could go down. Giannis has also shot 652 three pointers his career at 27%.

So, there is a big difference between the two players in how they take shots. Giannis obviously sees he needs to take three pointers to keep the defense honest. Simmons doesn't even try.

And because of that Simmons is putting up almost identical stats as last year and shows no development. Until he starts taking outside shots and hitting them, Simmons will probably just be what he is now for a long time.

And if he is going to stay like this most coaches will just steal Boston's game plan from last year and have him put up numbers below his regular season averages in more minutes played per game

Career Reg season - Playoffs vs Boston
33.6 - 36.4 MPG
15.8 - 14.4 PPG
8.4 - 8.2 RPG
8.1 - 7.4 APG
55.2 - 47.5 FG%
3.4 - 4.8 TOVPG.

So his per 36 numbers of his career would make his per game points scored, rebounds and assists look even higher as compared to that Boston playoff series. Boston established the blueprint on how to frustrate him and limit Simmons' impact.

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1587 on: December 17, 2018, 10:56:14 AM »

Online Moranis

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 33461
  • Tommy Points: 1533
The trade between Phoenix and Philly showed that Kelly Oubre has much higher trade value then Fultz. Keep on mind that Phoenix actually wants young players, especially point guards.

Seems to me that Philly will once again wait their asset value to deprecate then do a deal. (Noel, Okafor)

This is a good point. I guarantee that Ariza and Daniels was on the table for Fultz and Chandler.

Ariza would help the Sixers a lot, and he is an expiring, which gives them the flexibility this off-season they want. Plus, Daniels is a shooter that could help them.
I don't see why Philly would do that trade at all. 
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1588 on: December 17, 2018, 11:13:35 AM »

Online Moranis

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 33461
  • Tommy Points: 1533
Simmons this year has actually regressed in his outside shooting. Last year he took 79% of his shots from inside 10 feet. In last year's playoffs that went to 86%. This season it's at a tick over 90%. He isn't even trying to take shots outside of ten feet. Out of 1459 shots he has taken in his career, playoffs included, he has taken 12 three pointers and made none. This year he has not hit a hot from outside of 16 feet.

Think about that. Out of 336 shots so far this year he hasn't hit one from outside 16 feet. That makes game planning for him and the Philly offense in a 7 game series so easy

How does he compare to Giannis then.

Guess Simmons just isn't freakish enough to justify having zero jumpshot.
Giannis, for his career has these percentages of shots taken within 10 feet
57.4%
68.4%
68.9%
64.5%
61.7%
73.7%

So he averages about 65% of his shots from within 10 feet on any given year, though this year he is at his career highest of 73.7%. Lots of season still to play so that could go down. Giannis has also shot 652 three pointers his career at 27%.

So, there is a big difference between the two players in how they take shots. Giannis obviously sees he needs to take three pointers to keep the defense honest. Simmons doesn't even try.

And because of that Simmons is putting up almost identical stats as last year and shows no development. Until he starts taking outside shots and hitting them, Simmons will probably just be what he is now for a long time.

And if he is going to stay like this most coaches will just steal Boston's game plan from last year and have him put up numbers below his regular season averages in more minutes played per game

Career Reg season - Playoffs vs Boston
33.6 - 36.4 MPG
15.8 - 14.4 PPG
8.4 - 8.2 RPG
8.1 - 7.4 APG
55.2 - 47.5 FG%
3.4 - 4.8 TOVPG.

So his per 36 numbers of his career would make his per game points scored, rebounds and assists look even higher as compared to that Boston playoff series. Boston established the blueprint on how to frustrate him and limit Simmons' impact.
5 games is such a small sample size though.  If you take out game 2, this is what Simmons averaged in the series. 

37.8 mpg, 17.8 ppg, 9.0 rpg, 6.25 apg, 50.9%, 4.75 tpg (he also averaged 1.25 steals and 1.0 blocks in those 4 games).  So aside from his assists he was up across the board (and right around his per 36 average from the regular season).  He had 3 of the 5 games shooting greater than 53% from the field (the other was 40%). 

You can't pretend game 2 didn't happen, but game 2 absolutely skews the numbers for Simmons, and with such a small sample size, it skews them a lot. 
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip

Re: All Things Philadelphia 76ers (merged Sixers threads)
« Reply #1589 on: December 17, 2018, 11:21:08 AM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

  • Paul Silas
  • ******
  • Posts: 6043
  • Tommy Points: 766
The trade between Phoenix and Philly showed that Kelly Oubre has much higher trade value then Fultz. Keep on mind that Phoenix actually wants young players, especially point guards.

Seems to me that Philly will once again wait their asset value to deprecate then do a deal. (Noel, Okafor)

This is a good point. I guarantee that Ariza and Daniels was on the table for Fultz and Chandler.

Ariza would help the Sixers a lot, and he is an expiring, which gives them the flexibility this off-season they want. Plus, Daniels is a shooter that could help them.
I don't see why Philly would do that trade at all.

I see why Philly would do it. They get a guy who fits perfectly as they make a run this year. He can pretty much be Robert Covington for them for one year (and he's way better than Chandler). They get another bench shooter. Plus, depending on what Butler resigns for, they would have at least 24 million in cap space to use this off-season to chase another big name (which they wouldn't have with Fultz on the books).

I realize its not what they might have hoped for Fultz, but it would put them in a better position to win this year, in the off-season, and in the next few years.