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Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: j804 on January 08, 2013, 02:09:58 AM

Title: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: j804 on January 08, 2013, 02:09:58 AM: I know we all get on him for his bad games so how about showing some love for how he did tonight. Seriously though his spark on offense being aggressive and his defense on Carmelo if he can give us that in the playoffs that is all we need. I see a lot of trade scenarios where people want to ship him and bring back a guy like Francisco Garcia well Melo would have eaten him alive. I'm glad we have a guy like Green who will not get totally abused up against Melo or even LeBron, plus I think Jeff will get better as the year goes on having had heart surgery not even a year ago.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: jackson_34 on January 08, 2013, 02:30:03 AM: Good showing from Green tonight. Had Novak on him for most of the game and took full advantage of this.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Galeto on January 08, 2013, 02:57:36 AM: I loved how Green took it to Novak. Despite Novak having good synergy numbers on defense or not, it was a huge mismatch and I'm glad Green took advantage of it. The Knicks have too often gotten the benefit of Novak's offense without suffering from teams exploiting him on defense. Besides a few settled-for jumpers in a row in the third, he exploited Novak's lack of lateral quickness all game.

One thing I noticed is that Green takes off far too far from the rim. He's been doing that most of the season but I thought it was because defenders were able to stay chest to chest with him on his drives and angle him away from the rim. Since he still did with Novak guarding him, I think it's just a bad habit. He would be a much more dangerous and effective driver if he didn't rush things and took an extra step and dribble before putting up a shot.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: drax on January 08, 2013, 04:38:50 AM: Quote
... One thing I noticed is that Green takes off far too far from the rim. He's been doing that most of the season but I thought it was because defenders were able to stay chest to chest with him on his drives and angle him away from the rim. Since he still did with Novak guarding him, I think it's just a bad habit. ...

Maybe he is still afraik of full contact. Wouldn't suprise me. Going full speed with the upper body against defenders after a heart surgery, isn't easy mentally i guess.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: cltc5 on January 08, 2013, 06:45:50 AM: He did well last nite
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: ACF on January 08, 2013, 06:55:20 AM: (http://celticfanchat.files.wordpress.com/2012/11/jeff-green.jpg?w=460)
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: mctyson on January 08, 2013, 06:58:18 AM: Quote from: j804 on January 08, 2013, 02:09:58 AM
I know we all get on him for his bad games so how about showing some love for how he did tonight. Seriously though his spark on offense being aggressive and his defense on Carmelo if he can give us that in the playoffs that is all we need. I see a lot of trade scenarios where people want to ship him and bring back a guy like Francisco Garcia well Melo would have eaten him alive. I'm glad we have a guy like Green who will not get totally abused up against Melo or even LeBron, plus I think Jeff will get better as the year goes on having had heart surgery not even a year ago.

This is why we brought him back for 4 years at the money he got. People want to see an offensive superstar because Green has the tools offensively to be dominant. But that's not the player he is.

He is, however, the only guy on our roster who can defend Melo and Lebron over a 48 minute game. Pierce can try, but we need to save his legs for our offense. There was a reason Pierce was so fresh late in the game; Green did a lot of the dirty work on Melo early on.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Celtics4ever on January 08, 2013, 07:13:45 AM: It was nice to see him play well but I hope it continues rather than the up down we normally see with Jeff.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: chambers on January 08, 2013, 07:14:23 AM: Even if he's having an off shooting night, the one thing he can control is his defense. Tonight he was excellent on Melo, he was great on Novak and closing out on him too- Novak hit some lasers with Green right in his face.
He was even capable guarding Amare down low- although he got schooled on one occasion.

The great part about this game for Jeff Green is that it was a playoff like atmosphere and he rose to the occasion- kind of like Rondo has a habit of doing.

Definitely won't complain about Jeff Green tonight. Gave me a bit more hope for him.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Kuberski1 on January 08, 2013, 08:18:44 AM: Great to see Jeff played a big role in a tough road win (didn't see game).

Coming into the season, we all had big expectations from our bench. I think the general consensus might be one of disappointment - but am getting the feel that what we are seeing is that one or maybe two of the guys will step up and score, and the others not, depending on whose hitting shots, match-ups, and how many minutes they get (other than KG's back-up, the minutes somewhat scattered for the bench guys).

But they are still a talented bunch that can help a lot, both as we go through the season - our starters to date have been relatively healthy, but I don't expect that to late, and in the POs, where rotations shorten, but we'll have 8-9 guys we can play, which will help keep up the intensity on both ends of the floor.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: twistedrico14 on January 08, 2013, 08:42:35 AM: Jeff Green is another player I would like to see the Celtics keep. All this trade talk is a bunch of nonsense. If Danny moves anyone it will probably be Brandon Bass. He is the most expendable.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Edgar on January 08, 2013, 08:46:03 AM: still need free agentt size

Get Birdman and fight all the way with this roster
just teach them some aikido, and some jujitsu and we will be fine
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Bankshot on January 08, 2013, 08:47:39 AM: I think Green needs to play at least 25 mpg. He seems to need to get into a rhythm. He's not effective when he only plays 15 minutes.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: SHAQATTACK on January 08, 2013, 08:59:05 AM: Novac might make a lot of points , but he gives up alot of points to players like Pierce and Green. SO it can become a wash if the coach is not careful with his minutes .

Green was solid last night. No complaints. Not an all star ...but filled in nice for foul plagued Paul Pierce .

COme on FAb Melo , hurry up !!
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: BudweiserCeltic on January 08, 2013, 09:19:37 AM: Green was really good. I've been saying for 2 years now, but Green guards Melo well.

He had his offense going, but he still looks a bit uncomfortable out there, like he's not sure what Doc wants him to do. I'd rather have him spotting up in the corner and constantly cutting to the basket, and let his offense come that way, with the occasional post-up when the match-up is there.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: D.o.s. on January 08, 2013, 09:23:07 AM: He does seem to have success guarding players like 'Melo and KD (and as a Thunder alum, this makes a fair amount of sense), and he certainly took it to Novak last night.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: ManUp on January 08, 2013, 09:24:20 AM: Not awesome enough to find a trade.

I've seen this Jeff Green before.

I want to see what happens in the next 3-4 games.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Snakehead on January 08, 2013, 09:26:57 AM: Quote from: drax on January 08, 2013, 04:38:50 AM
Quote
... One thing I noticed is that Green takes off far too far from the rim. He's been doing that most of the season but I thought it was because defenders were able to stay chest to chest with him on his drives and angle him away from the rim. Since he still did with Novak guarding him, I think it's just a bad habit. ...

Maybe he is still afraik of full contact. Wouldn't suprise me. Going full speed with the upper body against defenders after a heart surgery, isn't easy mentally i guess.

I'm not so sure that this is a flaw as much as a style. I've really just seen him doing this year but it's very reminiscent of Worthy. His length is a big asset and this is using it.

There are times where he does take off too early but overall I think it's pretty effective.

It's led to some of the spectacular dunks he's had this year.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: moiso on January 08, 2013, 09:33:13 AM: Quote from: ManUp on January 08, 2013, 09:24:20 AM
Not awesome enough to find a trade.

I've seen this Jeff Green before.

I want to see what happens in the next 3-4 games.
And as Tommy said "I could score on Novak."
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: fanofgreen on January 08, 2013, 09:58:46 AM: Quote from: drax on January 08, 2013, 04:38:50 AM
Quote
... One thing I noticed is that Green takes off far too far from the rim. He's been doing that most of the season but I thought it was because defenders were able to stay chest to chest with him on his drives and angle him away from the rim. Since he still did with Novak guarding him, I think it's just a bad habit. ...

Maybe he is still afraik of full contact. Wouldn't suprise me. Going full speed with the upper body against defenders after a heart surgery, isn't easy mentally i guess.

In my estimation, its just poor footwork. He doesn't seem to have the ability to have "choppy feet", he has slow feet, that's his problem with quick offensive players, but with guys like Melo and Bron with similar size as him, he can body-up and make up for his lack of lateral foot quickness
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: pearljammer10 on January 08, 2013, 10:01:57 AM: Quote from: drax on January 08, 2013, 04:38:50 AM
Quote
... One thing I noticed is that Green takes off far too far from the rim. He's been doing that most of the season but I thought it was because defenders were able to stay chest to chest with him on his drives and angle him away from the rim. Since he still did with Novak guarding him, I think it's just a bad habit. ...

Maybe he is still afraik of full contact. Wouldn't suprise me. Going full speed with the upper body against defenders after a heart surgery, isn't easy mentally i guess.

I definitely think this has something to do with. The play he fell hard he was very cautious to get back up. I think by playing more aggressive like he did last night will break that mentality.

Great aggressive game on both ends of the floor for him last night.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: BleedGreen1989 on January 08, 2013, 10:19:25 AM: The problem with Jeff Green isn't his abilities, it's his consistency that people question. With Jeff's ability there's no reason he can't average 15/5 with this team
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: CelticG1 on January 08, 2013, 10:28:36 AM: I think it's a minutes thing completely.

He's not a scoring spark the just scores in bunches quickly.

He played 25 min tonight, a lot for him and he produced.

I don't have numbers in front of me but it seems more often than not when he gets decent minutes he produces.

Def moreso than Terry or Bass it seems like
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Edgar on January 08, 2013, 10:30:19 AM: Quote from: pearljammer10 on January 08, 2013, 10:01:57 AM
Quote from: drax on January 08, 2013, 04:38:50 AM
Quote
... One thing I noticed is that Green takes off far too far from the rim. He's been doing that most of the season but I thought it was because defenders were able to stay chest to chest with him on his drives and angle him away from the rim. Since he still did with Novak guarding him, I think it's just a bad habit. ...

Maybe he is still afraik of full contact. Wouldn't suprise me. Going full speed with the upper body against defenders after a heart surgery, isn't easy mentally i guess.

I definitely think this has something to do with. The play he fell hard he was very cautious to get back up. I think by playing more aggressive like he did last night will break that mentality.

Great aggressive game on both ends of the floor for him last night.

he can use a little

(http://www.copycare.es/resources/images/29431.jpg)
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: rutzan on January 08, 2013, 10:39:46 AM: Wins
11, 6, 12, 7, 16, 9, 17, 1, 19, 16, 15, 3, 15, 2, 3, 16, 8 = 184 = 10.82 pts/gm
( 5 games with 6 pts or less )

Losses
11, 3, 4, 5, 6, 5, 2, 18, 19, 9, 10, 3, 14, 8, 6, 16, 10 = 149 = 8.76pts/gm
( 8 games with 6 pts or less )

Double Figures = 16 games out of 34 games( Celtics Record = 9/7 )

Games with 12 pts or more ( Celtics Record = 8/4 )

Median is approx 9

i guess no real surprise...he is consistently inconsistent...if he could be more consistent...that would be huge...i don't think he needs much of a bump...12 pts per game seemed as good of a cut-off as any...our record jumps to 8/4 at that point...
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: mctyson on January 08, 2013, 10:53:26 AM: Quote from: BleedGreen1989 on January 08, 2013, 10:19:25 AM
The problem with Jeff Green isn't his abilities, it's his consistency that people question. With Jeff's ability there's no reason he can't average 15/5 with this team

Yeah, there are reasons for this. The first being that he is buried on the bench behind Pierce and averaging only 23 minutes a game, the lowest total of his career.

The second being that, given the match-up, he might play more PF in one game versus another. His scoring production is probably best when he is playing SF.

The third is: we don't need 15/5 from him every night. What we need from him is exactly what he brought on the defensive end last night, and the points are gravy. Sure we need him to score, but there are PLENTY of guys on our roster who can score.

There is only one who can defend Melo and Lebron at an elite level. Green.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: rutzan on January 08, 2013, 11:51:55 AM: the one thing i am concerned about is that he scored 6 pts or less in 13 games...that is 38% of the time...almost 4 out of every 10 games...that is 1.5 games to 2.7 games in a 4 - 7 game playoff series...
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: rutzan on January 08, 2013, 12:04:47 PM: 23mpg in 34 games
24mpg in 17 losses
22mpg in 17 wins
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: gar on January 08, 2013, 12:20:38 PM: Not awesome enough. He still looked hesitant even when one on one with Novak. He needs to be more aggressive on offense.

On defense he is often the first guy back and has played Durant, Lebron and Melo well. So he is a definite asset; but he has to be more consistent and more agressive against lesser opponents to exploit the opportunities and the advantages he does have over other players given the match up problems he can create at both SF and PF.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: j804 on January 09, 2013, 05:36:01 AM: Quote from: mctyson on January 08, 2013, 06:58:18 AM
Quote from: j804 on January 08, 2013, 02:09:58 AM
I know we all get on him for his bad games so how about showing some love for how he did tonight. Seriously though his spark on offense being aggressive and his defense on Carmelo if he can give us that in the playoffs that is all we need. I see a lot of trade scenarios where people want to ship him and bring back a guy like Francisco Garcia well Melo would have eaten him alive. I'm glad we have a guy like Green who will not get totally abused up against Melo or even LeBron, plus I think Jeff will get better as the year goes on having had heart surgery not even a year ago.
He is, however, the only guy on our roster who can defend Melo and Lebron over a 48 minute game. Pierce can try, but we need to save his legs for our offense. There was a reason Pierce was so fresh late in the game; Green did a lot of the dirty work on Melo early on.
Agreed
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: 2short on January 09, 2013, 06:33:08 AM: great job on defense by jeff which is oddly more important than the nice job on offense he did
the playoffs in the east go through the sf position, lebron and carmelo are younger, bigger and more athletic than pierce is now, green will be a difference
pierce played on 1 leg last year and we almost beat miami, backup sf was pietrus? last year who was also injured

if ainge's plan does work our sf and sg positions don't have much of a let down when subs come in, almost tommy ball like, run opposing teams into the ground
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Greenbean on January 09, 2013, 07:03:33 AM: Quote from: Bankshot on January 08, 2013, 08:47:39 AM
I think Green needs to play at least 25 mpg. He seems to need to get into a rhythm. He's not effective when he only plays 15 minutes.

I agree...offensively he is an iso player so he needs to settle in. It's not like he's coming in and moving a lot away from the ball and getting easy looks....which would be nice but right now it isn't his game.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: PhoSita on January 09, 2013, 08:00:33 AM: I really liked what I saw from Green on defense.

His shooting is flukey because he doesn't consistently take high percentage shots or get to the line. I think he's slowly figuring out ways to operate in the half-court set, but he's always going to have a much easier time scoring when the Celtics get out in transition. Now that they're getting more stops, they'll get in transition more and that should help him find himself.

I hope.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: danglertx on January 09, 2013, 08:40:52 PM: Nothing wrong with his two dunks in the first half of the Phoenix game.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: diconzo on January 09, 2013, 08:45:43 PM: Quote from: Greenbean on January 09, 2013, 07:03:33 AM
Quote from: Bankshot on January 08, 2013, 08:47:39 AM
I think Green needs to play at least 25 mpg. He seems to need to get into a rhythm. He's not effective when he only plays 15 minutes.

I agree...offensively he is an iso player so he needs to settle in. It's not like he's coming in and moving a lot away from the ball and getting easy looks....which would be nice but right now it isn't his game.

If our offense continues to click, Pierce's minutes could be decreased to give Jeff more, benefiting Paul and Jeff. We don't need to wear out our 35 year old scoring machine in the regular season, let him do his crafty 30-point games in the playoffs.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: rondohondo on January 09, 2013, 08:49:44 PM: oops wrong thread
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: bfrombleacher on January 09, 2013, 10:48:44 PM: http://www.nba.com/games/20130109/PHXBOS/gameinfo.html

All 3 Jeff Green dunks making the highlights for the game. Love it.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Interceptor on January 10, 2013, 12:52:19 AM: This thread has the potential to be as epic as the Avery Bradley = garbage thread, for a non-ironic reason. Green is really coming into his own now.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: jdz101 on January 10, 2013, 02:51:53 AM: I have a formula for the past two games.

The better guard defense has caused more turnovers.

More turnovers lead to more transition opportunities.

More transition opportunities means more chances for jeff to jam on people's heads.

More jams lead to beastmode jeff appearing.

Beastmode jeff leads to better numbers.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: lightspeed5 on January 10, 2013, 02:55:26 AM: (http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2013/0109/bos_u_jeff-green_mb_576.jpg)
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: sdceltsfan on January 10, 2013, 03:30:23 AM: Unless Jeff is wide open, I don't want him taking more than 3 or 4 shots outside of 18 feet. He is so much more deadly for this team as a slasher. Sure, feed him on the perimeter to give his lengthiness some spacing. He is by far the best slasher on the team besides Rondo, and he has the size/athleticism to be one of the most effective in the league. His freethrow shooting is solid.

How is Doc not drawing up more plays for this guy, that we pay 8 mil and change????

Green should be coming in as the 6th man, over Terry, for Pierce. Give him 25-30mpg. Take some more minutes off of the regular season workload for PP, and just plain take them away from Bass and give them to Green/Sully. I'm tired of seeing Bass's predictable, weak-sauce 8-12 footers chiming off the rim.

Bass needs to be banging the boards down low, and throwing his body around underneath. He has the strength to be a lot scrappier......he should be taking notes from Sullinger at this point. Bass needs to covert to more of a Powe, garbage man for this team.

Define the roles Doc!

(I may get totally blasted for this observation, but does Jeff Green not show some flashes of DR J in his game, or am I totally high? Obviously not from a consistency point of view, but just the way his arms and body move when he makes strong plays towards the basket. Aggressive in the most graceful way possible. He really could be one of the better slashers in the league if he played angry all the time. Looked like he had something to prove tonite, a year after his surgery.)
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: ausbacker on January 10, 2013, 04:35:35 AM: I wish some of KG's aggressiveness would rub off on Green all the time. He'd be a super player with a little aggression.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: mctyson on January 10, 2013, 06:35:37 AM: Quote from: jdz101 on January 10, 2013, 02:51:53 AM
I have a formula for the past two games.

The better guard defense has caused more turnovers.

More turnovers lead to more transition opportunities.

More transition opportunities means more chances for jeff to jam on people's heads.

More jams lead to beastmode jeff appearing.

Beastmode jeff leads to better numbers.

Actually, he jams on peoples heads when he gets set in iso situations and beats PFs, who have no business manning him up, off the dribble.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: jdz101 on January 10, 2013, 06:41:06 AM: Quote from: mctyson on January 10, 2013, 06:35:37 AM
Quote from: jdz101 on January 10, 2013, 02:51:53 AM
I have a formula for the past two games.

The better guard defense has caused more turnovers.

More turnovers lead to more transition opportunities.

More transition opportunities means more chances for jeff to jam on people's heads.

More jams lead to beastmode jeff appearing.

Beastmode jeff leads to better numbers.

Actually, he jams on peoples heads when he gets set in iso situations and beats PFs, who have no business manning him up, off the dribble.

Well Im not sure it matters whether you're a PF or a SF. If jeff gets a step on you on that left hand wing and you allow him to wheel around on his right hand....it will end in JAM :P
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Tr1boy on January 10, 2013, 07:37:01 AM: When Green drives for baskets good things happen to his game.

He shoots better, plays better defense etc.

If Green playing this way, he is worth what he was signed for and we don't need to trade him away.

If he can do a pattern of three good games in a row then play one mediocre/bad game, i can live with that
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: SHAQATTACK on January 10, 2013, 08:06:26 AM: Cudos for Green , another solid game under his belt.

Pierce is a great cheerleader. I liked seeing Green getting good minutes on the court.

Like to see Green put some defense on HArdin.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: pearljammer10 on January 10, 2013, 08:11:54 AM: Quote from: SHAQATTACK on January 10, 2013, 08:06:26 AM
Cudos for Green , another solid game under his belt.

Pierce is a great cheerleader. I liked seeing Green getting good minutes on the court.

Like to see Green put some defense on HArdin.

Gotta agree. If Green can play like this and give Pierce some extra rest all the better. Hopefully games like this will break Green out into a consistent 12 to 14 ppg scorer.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Snakehead on January 10, 2013, 08:14:53 AM: The drive past Beasley and dunk over Jermaine is his best of the year. Super aggressive and an impressive drive considering he really wasn't given much of an angle. It was all his length.

I've said it before: with all our wing and guard depth some are going to be left in the cold on a given night. Not that Green has been real consistent but between him, Jet, Lee, Bradley... someone will get a bit left in the cold or the scoring will be balanced.

Anyways, love to see him play that way.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Fafnir on January 10, 2013, 08:39:53 AM: Quote from: Snakehead on January 10, 2013, 08:14:53 AM
The drive past Beasley and dunk over Jermaine is his best of the year. Super aggressive and an impressive drive considering he really wasn't given much of an angle. It was all his length.

I've said it before: with all our wing and guard depth some are going to be left in the cold on a given night. Not that Green has been real consistent but between him, Jet, Lee, Bradley... someone will get a bit left in the cold or the scoring will be balanced.

Anyways, love to see him play that way.
Yeah.

I was glad Doc gave the bench the time on the court when they clearly had better energy than the starters.
Title: Re: How awesome was Jeff Green
Post by: Edgar on January 10, 2013, 12:22:32 PM: Quote from: Fafnir on January 10, 2013, 08:39:53 AM
Quote from: Snakehead on January 10, 2013, 08:14:53 AM
The drive past Beasley and dunk over Jermaine is his best of the year. Super aggressive and an impressive drive considering he really wasn't given much of an angle. It was all his length.

I've said it before: with all our wing and guard depth some are going to be left in the cold on a given night. Not that Green has been real consistent but between him, Jet, Lee, Bradley... someone will get a bit left in the cold or the scoring will be balanced.

Anyways, love to see him play that way.
Yeah.

I was glad Doc gave the bench the time on the court when they clearly had better energy than the starters.

aand thats pretty much all he had to do all year long

except when nobody had energy and we had some of those games this year

with "the pest" out there i dont think they will be that many more of them.