Whats Stopping us from having a season like last years Phoenix Suns

[obnoxiousmime]

Haha, I forgot about Evan Turner! He'll make a huge difference I'm sure. I mean, imagine how many games the Sixers sacrificed just by trading him -- they coulda been a 20 win team easy .

Oh yeah, he did have that big shot against the Celtics last year, so I guess there's at least one!

[ImShakHeIsShaq]

Do I see us being able to win 20 more games than last season? Yep, it's not as wild a # as people suggest. Heck, we could have been at least 10 games better last season on games we coughed up alone!


Plumlee and Sully a tie? So, you would trade Sully for him straight up? I doubt it. I love the Plumlees as a Duke fan, he's good but I'm not doing that deal.

We probably lost about at least 10 more games by forcing RR.

Probably lost some because of getting rid of JCraw.

Injuries.

New coach and all but 5 new players.

Yep, we could have won around 20 more last season. This is a new season with changes to some East teams, I dunno if it will be as easy as it was last season. I don't think it's impossible though.

That logic is always faulty to me because you're not counting the games the team could easily have lost but managed to win. It's like saying, "well just one made field goal and the Pats would have been 12-4." The counterpoint is you could easily play the what if game with wins as well. Last season the Pats might have won an extra game or two, but they were also fortunate to escape from a few games with a W. Why aren't those games included in the estimate?

The main reason it's very unlikely to happen is the team did not make an acquisition on the level of a Bledsoe, Frye, Green, or Plumlee this offseason (not to mention the Suns got a new coach who might be pretty good). The Celtics are pretty much the same besides adding Thornton, Zeller, Smart, and Young. I don't really see any of those guys making such a dramatic difference in wins and losses this season.

You are right about the East possibly being weaker though. The Pacers are already going to be missing George and Stephenson and Miami lost LeBron, so the top two Eastern teams from last year are weaker. We also have not seen the new look Cavs yet and who knows if Rose will return to form. The Hawks are going through a crazy ownership/management situation.

On the negative side, a lot of the Eastern talent that moved just went to other Eastern teams (Pierce, McRoberts, Stephenson, Deng, Mike Miller, Ray Allen) and notable Western players moved to the East like Love, Frye, Calderon, Gasol, and Marion. We might just see a stronger middle class in the East as opposed to the top heavy conference of last year. Whether that means more Ws for the Celtics remains to be seen.

The games we could have lost, we would have won by more, so it wouldn't have been toss up hehe! ;P

[bleedGREENdon]

Rondo > Dragic
Bradley < Bledsoe
Green > Gerald Geeen
Sully > Morris
Zeller < Plumlee ( and I don't think zeller is that badly worse then plumlee same goes for Bradley and Bledsoe)

So we win out right 3 out of 5 positions.

Now bench

Smart < Thomas (just off of smart never playing but I can see this easily changing)
Thorton > Archie Griffin ( listed as there backup SG right now.. I mean idk who he is so this is just off thortons experience)
Turner > T.J Warren ( experience goes to Trner
Kelly > Morris ( I'm going out on a limb here and might be a little but of a homer but I do see Kelly as clearly a better option then Morris or Shavlik.)
Faveroni < Alex Zen or Okafor ( hasn't played much, but honestly who ever the suns backup center is better then our backups for sure)

Suns might have the better bench, it's all key on how Kelly and Smart play. Those two are actually going to be X Factors all year. If they play mature beyond their years then I believe the celtics are closer to being a winning team then the suns are, and will make the playoffs this year.

The doubt this forum has on this team is sad. Have some optimism. The Heat were CLEAR favorites all year, spurs were again under estimated, and they went out and clapped the heat in the finals.

Remember the games still need to be played. We are one move away from being contenders again. With plenty of assets and talent. Don't sleep.

[fitzhickey]

Rondo = Dragic
Bradley < Bledsoe
Green = Gerald Geeen
Sully > Morris
Zeller < Plumlee ( and I don't think zeller is that badly worse then plumlee same goes for Bradley and Bledsoe)

Think you're underrating Dragic and Gerald Green.
They both had career seasons last year, while Jeff Green always has the danger of getting lost, and Rondo is still relatively unknown if he will return to form.

[GetLucky]

29 other teams and approximately 435 other player.

TP for optimism though; I would love if it happened (with the loyal C's fan attendance of course).

[MBunge]

The Celtics are pretty much the same besides adding Thornton, Zeller, Smart, and Young. I don't really see any of those guys making such a dramatic difference in wins and losses this season.

Thornton>Bayliss
Smart>Pressley
Turner>Wallace
Zeller/Anthony>Humphries/Sully, strictly when talking about better fits at center.

Add in that Rondo, Sully and KO should all reasonably see some improvement over last season.

Mike

[D.o.s.]

The Celtics are pretty much the same besides adding Thornton, Zeller, Smart, and Young. I don't really see any of those guys making such a dramatic difference in wins and losses this season.

Thornton>Bayliss
Smart>Pressley
Turner>Wallace
Zeller/Anthony>Humphries/Sully, strictly when talking about better fits at center.

Add in that Rondo, Sully and KO should all reasonably see some improvement over last season.

Mike

No love for Lee and Crawford?

Our guard rotation is about as talented as it was last year. Our wing rotation is about as talented as it was last year. Our big man rotation is about as talented as it was last year.

I think we'll be better, but my suspicion is that we're not winning more than 31 games.

[Rondo9]

The Celtics are pretty much the same besides adding Thornton, Zeller, Smart, and Young. I don't really see any of those guys making such a dramatic difference in wins and losses this season.

Thornton>Bayliss
Smart>Pressley
Turner>Wallace
Zeller/Anthony>Humphries/Sully, strictly when talking about better fits at center.

Add in that Rondo, Sully and KO should all reasonably see some improvement over last season.

Mike

No love for Lee and Crawford?

Our guard rotation is about as talented as it was last year. Our wing rotation is about as talented as it was last year. Our big man rotation is about as talented as it was last year.

I think we'll be better, but my suspicion is that we're not winning more than 31 games.

The point he's making is that the rotation is more balanced and talented than last year. Add in a hopefully healthy Rondo and improvements from Olynyk, Sullinger and Bradley and they should be better than last year.

[D.o.s.]

That would mean that the point he's making is wrong. 

[MBunge]

The Celtics are pretty much the same besides adding Thornton, Zeller, Smart, and Young. I don't really see any of those guys making such a dramatic difference in wins and losses this season.

Thornton>Bayliss
Smart>Pressley
Turner>Wallace
Zeller/Anthony>Humphries/Sully, strictly when talking about better fits at center.

Add in that Rondo, Sully and KO should all reasonably see some improvement over last season.

Mike

No love for Lee and Crawford?

Our guard rotation is about as talented as it was last year. Our wing rotation is about as talented as it was last year. Our big man rotation is about as talented as it was last year.

I think we'll be better, but my suspicion is that we're not winning more than 31 games.

I'm looking at the team that finished out the year, not the one where Lee and Crawford were gone just as Rondo started to play.

So, it probably should have been Turner>Chris Johnson.

Either way, Turner is going to be better than whomever was Boston's backup SF last year, even if his own play doesn't improve a bit.  Smart is also going to immediately be better than Pressey, even if he shoots just as poorly.  At their age, both KO and Sully should show some improvement and with Zeller, Vitor and Anthony on the roster, they should spend far less time being outmatched at center.  Rondo should also be better with the knee injury further behind him.

Now, there were reason beyond just talent for why Boston lost so many games last year.  Rondo brought the offense to a stop too often.  The team's rotations needed work and they just flat out imploded when teams put pressure on them in the second half.  I'm not sure a modest improvement in talent and roster balance will fix those things.  But if those things can be fixed along with a talent boost, Boston could be surprisingly good next year.

Again, NOBODY thought the Suns were going to win like they did last season.

Mike

[gpap]

Either way, the Suns weren't good enough to make the playoffs and were just barely in the lottery.

I am hoping that's not the kind of season we have this year.

[CelticsFanFromNYC]

Either way, the Suns weren't good enough to make the playoffs and were just barely in the lottery.

I am hoping that's not the kind of season we have this year.

The Suns in the East wouldve been the 6th or 7th pick.  Celtics have the luxury in playing in that conference. While the draft would be the technicaly smart route to go (which hasnt treated us that amazing) we could try and compete to attract a player beside Rondo. If we just take the draft route yea we get a center but lose Rondo so what does that really do for us?

[tstorey_97]

I hope they win, I watch all the games.

One reason the starters were so poor last year was the end of games. Ainge made sure the roster was devoid of "go to guys." He got his wish. The Celtics outscored their opponents in the fourth quarter 29 times last season. I suggest, as above, this was Ainge's goal.

At the free throw line last year, the Celtics were 27th in the NBA in ATTEMPTS. They simply had zero inside game. This is a factor of the roster and thus, the GM. "take boat loads of 3 pointers and other assorted jumpers." This is a recipe for a high draft pick and nothing else.

I think Rondo is certainly a top point guard, I do not think he is well matched with this year's roster. He does not have enough scoring punch on the floor with him. I don't see how the addition of Zeller to this roster changes the Celtics into a playoff team. My guess is Ainge wants a top five pick again.

Marcus Smart, IMO, will eventually be a top point guard. He is courageous on defense and runs the court with confidence (which all PG's must do)

I think this is something to look forward to along with Olynyk as an off the bench scoring threat. He will open up the floor for his mates and hopefully, become the late game offense the Celtics are looking for. My guess is Sullinger will need to wait to be paired with a top center before he can reach his potential.....these are all good things to watch for this year.