When should the seat start to get hot?

[Who]

Can anyone think of super-quick firings?

In other sports like European soccer you can see a coach get fired in the first month of the season if things are terrible. Like Frank De Boer who was fired after only 5 games in England a few years ago. Things like that happen.

I struggle to think of anything like that in the NBA. Especially with a new head coach. A coach from the previous season may get fired 15-20 games in but a brand new one? I reckon that will take half a season of terrible results before leadership is willing to make that call.

[gift]

Gotta let Ime finish the year at least. If this season is a complete disappointment, at least you assess what you have based on a full season.

[boscel33]

Full season at least.  last night was the first time we've had no injuries listed although Brown is still dealing with Covid.

I'm not sure our starting lineup was the best that it can be.  I think I'd start Schroder, Brown, Tatum, Horford, and RWill.  I still believe Smart is best in the 6th man role.

[Celtics2021]

Can anyone think of super-quick firings?

In other sports like European soccer you can see a coach get fired in the first month of the season if things are terrible. Like Frank De Boer who was fired after only 5 games in England a few years ago. Things like that happen.

I struggle to think of anything like that in the NBA. Especially with a new head coach. A coach from the previous season may get fired 15-20 games in but a brand new one? I reckon that will take half a season of terrible results before leadership is willing to make that call.

Mike Brown lasted 5 games with the Lakers in the 2012-2013 season (his second with the team). 

For a newly hired coach, Jerry Tarkanian lasted 20 games with the Spurs in the early 90s.

While I'm pretty unpleased with how things are going, I think it'd be unfair to a rookie coach to give him so short a leash unless there are things we can't see behind the scenes.  There's definitely a learning curve, and certainly it takes longer than 7 games to figure everything out.  But he definitely hasn't figured it out yet.

[Rosco917]

This Celtic team needed an experienced, disciplinarian at the top spot. Not an inexperienced, young players coach.

Just as they needed a true PG with experience and league respect forcing players to move without the ball.

When you have young players swiftly becoming legends in the their own minds, you need a firm hand guiding them.

[Surferdad]

Is there any message in the hiring of Udoka other than "This is not our year, so we'll hire a new young coach with upside a few years from now to match our team transition to younger players." ?

[Mahk E Mahk]

if ime can’t figure it out, the best case scenario is a short leash next season, but i highly doubt it. he’s a rookie head coach hired by arguably the most storied franchise in basketball, who were very vocal about his fit and his hiring. unless he does something egregious that triggers a “termination for cause” firing, he gets more than one full season to work it out.

if this season continues to be a circus of losing, he will get the offseason to make changes to his coaching approach, his staff, and his offensive/defensive strategies. if next season is a repeat of this season, he still probably gets all of next season.

it’s frustrating but the c’s are going to avoid the controversy that would surround a quick trigger for ime. wyc and brad will be very conservative in their approach, while also being very supportive of ime publicly. buckle up, c’s fans, ime is here for a while. let’s hope he figures it out soon.

[PhoSita]

Is there any message in the hiring of Udoka other than "This is not our year, so we'll hire a new young coach with upside a few years from now to match our team transition to younger players." ?

What transition to younger players?

[jpotter33]

He should be feeling the pressure, but realistically I doubt he gets fired this year at all. If things got really bad I could maybe see around the deadline or ASB, but I’m doubting it.

And I think that’s fair. There was always going to be a learning curve as a new coach, and we’ve already dealt with a significant number of injuries and absences already.

And while Ime is certainly not doing a good job right now and is much greener than I think most of us hoped, a lot of this is on the players and the previous coaching, management, and ownership rather than Ime and this coaching staff. It’s painfully obvious at this point that there’s a culture/bad habits problem with our group that was created and allowed to thrive here previously (primarily I think our young stars and core players), and it’s going to take awhile for the new coaching staff to break those habits and toxic culture.

But it’s certainly not looking good at this point. I’m hoping Ime will unleash his mean streak and start holding these guys more accountable. Don’t see how you’re going to break this poor culture of laziness, selfishness, and inconsistent, dumb play otherwise.

[Goldstar88]

The starting lineups are also puzzling. Sure Smart, Brown, Tatum, Horford, Timelord might work against a select few teams that play two true Bigs like Indiana: Turner/Sabonis, Orlando: Wendell Carter Jr/Bamba,  or Cleavland with Mobley/Allen, but That lineup isn’t going to work against 80% of the teams in the league. It certainly didn’t work out tonight with DeRozan going off for 37 and shooting 75% from the field. Just seemed like a really bad idea going into the game considering the Bulls were only playing 1 big in Vucevic. Shouldn’t the starting lineup change depending on matchups?

I think we did fine in the beginning of the game, your comments have nothing to do with the real culprit of this loss.  Losing a 19 point lead, late in the game.   Starting two bigs had ZERO impact on why we lost.  Quite a few teams start the same guys, I would say more do than do not.

Some of the substitutions throughout the games are just puzzling, too. The small ball and unbalanced lineups where 3 or 4 players on the court are below average shooters. Ime does seem to do a better job when it comes to calling timeouts than Brad did, but other than that I’m not really seeing any positives. This is a talented roster with veteran players and two all-star wings. I’m starting to feel like the coach just doesn’t know how to manage the team and put them In a position to win

I do agree some of the lineups are puzzling.   

I think Ime's after the time out plays (ATOs) are horrible.  I also thought he did not handle timeouts well last night otherwise we'd might have shown more defensive fire after the timeouts.

Ultimately, I think this comes down to lacking  talent.   We have two all star wings.   But this roster is not that deep, huge talent disparities when some guys come off the bench to replace the starters in many cases.   I would point to the fact that deep teams with good role players have dismantled us thus far.  We are not a talented roster and what looks good on paper does not translate well to the playing field always.   The same day they extend Romeo, and Grant they lay a complete egg.   I did think Grant played hard as hell, he just lacks size.  Ainge did not leave us in a good state.   CBS improved some flexibility financially, and added some parts.
 
When we were losing that lead in the fourth and having trouble scoring, maybe put in Parker?  We were not getting stops, so his defense would not have mattered but at least we could have maintained the lead or put the ball in the hole.  Instant offense, can't help you on the bench.

Udoka, I think is on the hot seat, as of last night.   But I think he will be safe for quite a while due to the fact that he is a new hire.  I think he is safe until the end of Dec as well.  It is early still.   

Look on the bright side. With a little bit of luck, we'll end up with a nice pick at the end of the season.

That would help out our talent deficiency.

You mean when is BS in the hot seat. BS was the coach and saw this first hand. If he didn't correct things from players on the team than he is more at fault.

I doubt it.  Signing Shroder was a masterful move.   He made moves to save the owners money and brought back popular Al Horford.  I think Brad is safe.

When Derozan is matching up with Al Horford and Grant Williams and torching the C’s for 37 while shooting 75% from the field, I sort of feel like that contributed to the loss.

Not sure how you can say that this team is lacking talent. Smart, Brown, Tatum, Horford, Timelord is a quality starting 5. How many teams have a Dennis Schroder or Josh Richardson level talent coming in as their 6th and 7th man?

[flybono]

You pink hat fans continue to call out coaching when in fact it’s the player Smart and player Tatum
Both must go

Brown is the player to build around

Get it through your head

[Celtics4ever]

When Derozan is matching up with Al Horford and Grant Williams and torching the C’s for 37 while shooting 75% from the field, I sort of feel like that contributed to the loss.

I would counter that Grant Williams is a small ball player.   He does not have elite size and is a PF, at his natural position and he has the height of  a wing.   You've simply proven my point that bigger guys matter.

Not sure how you can say that this team is lacking talent. Smart, Brown, Tatum, Horford, Timelord is a quality starting 5. How many teams have a Dennis Schroder or Josh Richardson level talent coming in as their 6th and 7th man?

So you've not the seen the teams of deep role players take us down this season?   Tatum and Brown are big time talents.   

here are some stats of our deep talent

The Celtics were only able to get 24 bench points against the Chicago Bulls in a game that they lost after leading by 19 points. 13 of these 24 came from Dennis Schroder

We are 26th in bench scoring, 30th in bench rebounding, 29th in bench +/-

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/traditional/?dir=-1&Season=2021-22&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&StarterBench=Bench&sort=PTS

Our depth stinks

[Goldstar88]

When Derozan is matching up with Al Horford and Grant Williams and torching the C’s for 37 while shooting 75% from the field, I sort of feel like that contributed to the loss.

I would counter that Grant Williams is a small ball player.   He does not have elite size and is a PF, at his natural position and he has the height of  a wing.   You've simply proven my point that bigger guys matter.

Not sure how you can say that this team is lacking talent. Smart, Brown, Tatum, Horford, Timelord is a quality starting 5. How many teams have a Dennis Schroder or Josh Richardson level talent coming in as their 6th and 7th man?

So you've not the seen the teams of deep role players take us down this season?   Tatum and Brown are big time talents.   

here are some stats of our deep talent

The Celtics were only able to get 24 bench points against the Chicago Bulls in a game that they lost after leading by 19 points. 13 of these 24 came from Dennis Schroder

We are 26th in bench scoring, 30th in bench rebounding, 29th in bench +/-

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/traditional/?dir=-1&Season=2021-22&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&StarterBench=Bench&sort=PTS

Our depth stinks

Celtics went big, Chicago went small and the Bulls won the game. How am I proving your point? The shooters on the bench didn’t get any shots. Nesmith played 1 minute, no shot attempts and Pritchard had 1 shot in 7 minutes.

Tatum and Brown should be shooting 16-18 times per game. Then Horford should be in the 10-12 range. Letting Smart, Schroder and Richardson account for 28 shot attempts against the Bulls is not good coaching.

[Somebody]

Can anyone think of super-quick firings?

In other sports like European soccer you can see a coach get fired in the first month of the season if things are terrible. Like Frank De Boer who was fired after only 5 games in England a few years ago. Things like that happen.

I struggle to think of anything like that in the NBA. Especially with a new head coach. A coach from the previous season may get fired 15-20 games in but a brand new one? I reckon that will take half a season of terrible results before leadership is willing to make that call.

If anything we should learn from European football clubs and give him the sack immediately - the vibe man was never fit for coaching a club like us, he is our Ole.

[Goldstar88]

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