Kawhi Leonard Moving To Boston Celtics? Dwyane Wade Thinks So

[Roy H.]

It feels like Roy is the only guy who truly wants Leonard here (when you read most of the posts under this thread) 

Don’t worry, if the trade goes down 90% of the blog will be on board with it within 24 hours. Fan loyalty tends to last almost exactly as long as management decides to keep a player on a roster.

[Monkhouse]

If we add Kawhi while giving up Brown or Tatum without giving up both, we are the clear favorites to win the championship next year. Kawhi is quite literally the only player that can give Durant, Klay, or Curry absolute fits on defense.

[Alleyoopster]

Realize Kawhi is a great player and a lot of CB members love the idea of him coming to Boston.

I'm definitely not on board. Just seeing the post come up over and over again makes me nauseous. He has a serious injury and it hasn't healed in over a year. Chances are it could haunt him until he retires. Why all the interest in a broken product?

[nostar]

It feels like Roy is the only guy who truly wants Leonard here (when you read most of the posts under this thread) 

Lots of us want Leonard. The question is not do we want to trade for an mvp candidate. The questions are what are we giving up and will he stay long-term.

The only reason I'm not giving up both Js is that I don't think he would stay in Boston. If I knew he would stay, I'd have no hesitation in trading that package for him.

Ideally we'd keep Brown and move Jayson, Tito and the Sac19 pick (with salary filler).

I risk it. Not everyone would. Roy is not alone

[trickybilly]

It feels like Roy is the only guy who truly wants Leonard here (when you read most of the posts under this thread) 

Lots of us want Leonard. The question is not do we want to trade for an mvp candidate. The questions are what are we giving up and will he stay long-term.

The only reason I'm not giving up both Js is that I don't think he would stay in Boston. If I knew he would stay, I'd have no hesitation in trading that package for him.

Ideally we'd keep Brown and move Jayson, Tito and the Sac19 pick (with salary filler).

I risk it. Not everyone would. Roy is not alone

Less than negative zero farenheit chance Al is moved...

[Vermont Green]

Realize Kawhi is a great player and a lot of CB members love the idea of him coming to Boston.

I'm definitely not on board. Just seeing the post come up over and over again makes me nauseous. He has a serious injury and it hasn't healed in over a year. Chances are it could haunt him until he retires. Why all the interest in a broken product?

I don't know that you can state as fact that the injury will haunt him until he retires (I know you said "could") but any trade would be contingent on a physical.  Likely we would have access to medical records as part of the trade discussion.  Obviously, if it is determined that in fact the injury will never fully heal until he retires, then there will be no trade with anyone. 

I read somewhere that if there was a structural issue with the tendon or the connection of the tendon to the knee, that it should be easy to identify.  No one knows what is going on.  I imagine they have done tons of MRIs.  No one is going to trade for Kahwi unless they feel pretty sure what is going on.  I don't think there is enough information to deem him "damaged" or "broken" though.  I am sure plenty of teams (including Boston) will be happy have discussion on him.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Realize Kawhi is a great player and a lot of CB members love the idea of him coming to Boston.

I'm definitely not on board. Just seeing the post come up over and over again makes me nauseous. He has a serious injury and it hasn't healed in over a year. Chances are it could haunt him until he retires. Why all the interest in a broken product?

I don't know that you can state as fact that the injury will haunt him until he retires (I know you said "could") but any trade would be contingent on a physical.  Likely we would have access to medical records as part of the trade discussion.  Obviously, if it is determined that in fact the injury will never fully heal until he retires, then there will be no trade with anyone. 

I read somewhere that if there was a structural issue with the tendon or the connection of the tendon to the knee, that it should be easy to identify.  No one knows what is going on.  I imagine they have done tons of MRIs.  No one is going to trade for Kahwi unless they feel pretty sure what is going on.  I don't think there is enough information to deem him "damaged" or "broken" though.  I am sure plenty of teams (including Boston) will be happy have discussion on him.

Personally, if the Spurs' medical staff and whatever experts Leonard has had for his treatment to THIS day still can't agree on what is going on, I'm not going to trust what a Boston medical staff would evaluate based solely on a quick physical and historical medical records.

[nickagneta]

I also don't really want any part of a guy with a camp that will always be looking for 2nd opinions and stuff like that.

Why? Shouldn’t we want guys that take care of their bodies?

If memory serves, Kyrie got a second opinion. I would assume that most players do.

I would hope all pro athletes would go for 2nd and 3rd opinions on serious injuries or ailments. Their body is their main asset. Best to make sure you have the right diagnosis and getting the right treatment. An athlete should never be beholden to just one medical staff. Never

[nickagneta]

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/23366667/inside-tension-kawhi-leonard-spurs

It's starting to sound to me like maybe Kawhi has a really serious quad issue and I also don't really want any part of a guy with a camp that will always be looking for 2nd opinions and stuff like that.

I'd be fine with Kawhi once he makes it through a full season. But definitely not before.

From the article:

TO UNDERSTAND HOW the Spurs and Leonard got to this uncomfortable place, you must first understand the quadriceps injury that kept him out all season. And if you can do that, well, you might be way ahead of the specialists who have treated Leonard throughout this process. In conversations with multiple sources close to Leonard and the Spurs, there is some disagreement about the exact nature of the injury.

Leonard's camp believes his condition is the result of a series of contusions to the quadriceps that began with one very deep bruise in March 2016 that caused him to miss three games. Leonard was again listed with a "quad contusion" on the Feb. 6, 2017, injury report, when he was a late scratch before a game. But it wasn't until the end of last season when the severity of the injury became apparent.

According to multiple sources, Leonard's camp has come to believe the issue has more to do with an ossification, or hardening, in the area where the muscle has been repeatedly bruised, and then an atrophy, which in turn affected the tendons connecting the muscle to the knee.

The Spurs have always called the injury quadriceps tendinopathy, which is a disease of the tendon that has a degenerative effect on the muscle by keeping it in a constant state of exhaustion.

"Kawhi is the same person. The only thing that has changed about him is the people speaking for him now."
A league source with knowledge of the situation
The treatment course for each diagnosis (a muscle issue vs. a tendon issue) is different, which has become another source of tension in the relationship.

Initially the Spurs' doctors were calling the shots, with Leonard following their protocols for most of last summer in his workouts in San Antonio with team staffers and San Diego with his longtime personal trainer. But things began to change in August as Leonard continued to experience discomfort, according to sources.

His agent, Mitch Frankel, and uncle, Dennis Robertson, began pressing the Spurs to consult outside opinions. Last fall, Dr. Keith Pyne, the managing partner of SportsLab NYC, which is affiliated with the Washington Nationals and New York Islanders, began consulting on the case.

Leonard briefly returned to the Spurs for nine games from mid-December through mid-January. The Spurs were conservative in their approach. He'd play one game, then sit out the next game regardless of how many days later it was scheduled. After scoring 19 points in 28 minutes in a win over Denver on Jan. 13, he complained of soreness in the area once again. He traveled with the team to Atlanta -- a game he was scheduled to sit out anyway -- and Brooklyn, but instead of playing against the Nets, Popovich announced at shootaround that Leonard was being shut down indefinitely.

"He didn't reinjure it or anything, but he was having pain, but not right after games, but maybe the next day at noon or that kind of thing and so the pain wasn't dissipating," Popovich said at the time. "It wasn't going in the right direction."

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Popovich heartbroken by Kawhi news but looking aheadGregg Popovich says it's horrible to be without Kawhi Leonard indefinitely but sheds some light on the situation by explaining how the team is preparing for the remainder of the season.
What Popovich did not say at the time, however, was that while Leonard was in New York, he saw Dr. Jonathan Glashow, an orthopedic surgeon and co-chair of Sports Medicine at New York City's Mount Sinai Medical Center who has professional affiliations with the New Jersey Devils and Philadelphia 76ers.

Frankel and Robertson arranged the consultation, according to multiple sources, and the Spurs were informed of the decision and the doctor's recommendations. From this point forward, Glashow and his team have guided the rehabilitation program, sources said. The Spurs have had staffers in New York to observe and assist in Leonard's work, which has primarily taken place at the NBA Players Association headquarters in midtown Manhattan.

The frustration on the Spurs' end stems from losing control of the medical care of their franchise player, and the way in which the entire process has been handled by Leonard's representation, according to multiple sources.

So that people understand why Kawhi and the Spurs are at odds. The Spurs think its a tendon problem which has to be treated one way, was being treated that way and wasn't working. After 2nd and third opinions by well respected medical people, Kawhi is being told it is a muscle problem that is causing tendon pain. This problem requires a different treatment. Both problems could be long term degenerative problems. Could being the operative word there, so getting the right diagnosis and treatment is critical.

All this makes me see Kawhi as a guy out looking for his long term health and ability to make money. I don't see that as Jawhi quitting on his team or being a head case in any way. Hope he gets well soon.

[Tr1boy]

Leonard should listen to how his body feels 1st

then teams medical team. 

If the medical/trainning staff is not helping/improving his condition....then seek outside opinion with sign off from the team

doesnt seem like this is what happened and the Spurs staff didnt get a proper chance to help him heal. Then he just did his own thing 


Imo Leonard is a goner this off season.  Because I bet you, if he was a UFA , he would not be doing this

No team would sign him, if their doctors weren't allow to assess his situation and be able to help get him better

[Tr1boy]

Chris Mannix: “I think Boston will make a competitive offer [for Leonard]. And I think it’s possible that Kawhi Leonard is a Celtic next season.”

Don't think so Chris

Unless they be willing to take Al horford, Rozier, Semi and 2019 1st


Again if the Celts medical staff can't evaluate and be allowed to help with his issue....doesn't immediately hangs up the phone

[nickagneta]

Leonard should listen to how his body feels 1st

then teams medical team. 

If the medical/trainning staff is not helping/improving his condition....then seek outside opinion with sign off from the team

doesnt seem like this is what happened and the Spurs staff didnt get a proper chance to help him heal. Then he just did his own thing 


Imo Leonard is a goner this off season.  Because I bet you, if he was a UFA , he would not be doing this

No team would sign him, if their doctors weren't allow to assess his situation and be able to help get him better

Exactly why does he need to get a sign off from the team? So if they say no, the player has to abide by what the team medical staff says, even if they are wrong and could be doing more harm than good? No one, player or regular person should ever have to get a sign off from their employer to seek medical care.

And, the Spurs medical staff had been working on this problem since the end of the 2016-17 season and through the summer. Things weren't getting better or moving forward at all. So Kawhi 2nd opinions were sought. It sounds like the Spurs worked with an outside physician for a while. So for months and months and months, Kawhi did what the Spurs said and nothing was happening. How long is he supposed to continue doing what the team medical staff is telling him what to do if it isn't having a positive effect at all. It was at that point that he went to New York fir another opinion and then the Spurs seemed to get angry.

[Phantom255x]

It feels like Roy is the only guy who truly wants Leonard here (when you read most of the posts under this thread) 

Lots of us want Leonard. The question is not do we want to trade for an mvp candidate. The questions are what are we giving up and will he stay long-term.

The only reason I'm not giving up both Js is that I don't think he would stay in Boston. If I knew he would stay, I'd have no hesitation in trading that package for him.

Ideally we'd keep Brown and move Jayson, Tito and the Sac19 pick (with salary filler).

I risk it. Not everyone would. Roy is not alone

I mean yes, there are quite a few here who would love to acquire Leonard and wouldn't mind a reasonable package for him, but that idea is just... meh.

[Phantom255x]

Guys, Boston ISN'T even on Kawhi's preferred Trade List.

https://thebiglead.com/2018/05/01/kawhi-leonard-could-end-up-with-lakers-76ers-knicks-or-clippers-gregg-popovich-retiring/

It's Lakers, Clippers, Knicks or Sixers. *Maybe* even Miami according to one report I saw.

He wants a big market. All of them except maybe PHI are bigger markets than Boston I think. Either way, it doesn't look like BOS is on his trade list according to reports.

[Tr1boy]

Leonard should listen to how his body feels 1st

then teams medical team. 

If the medical/trainning staff is not helping/improving his condition....then seek outside opinion with sign off from the team

doesnt seem like this is what happened and the Spurs staff didnt get a proper chance to help him heal. Then he just did his own thing 


Imo Leonard is a goner this off season.  Because I bet you, if he was a UFA , he would not be doing this

No team would sign him, if their doctors weren't allow to assess his situation and be able to help get him better

Exactly why does he need to get a sign off from the team? So if they say no, the player has to abide by what the team medical staff says, even if they are wrong and could be doing more harm than good? No one, player or regular person should ever have to get a sign off from their employer to seek medical care.

And, the Spurs medical staff had been working on this problem since the end of the 2016-17 season and through the summer. Things weren't getting better or moving forward at all. So Kawhi 2nd opinions were sought. It sounds like the Spurs worked with an outside physician for a while. So for months and months and months, Kawhi did what the Spurs said and nothing was happening. How long is he supposed to continue doing what the team medical staff is telling him what to do if it isn't having a positive effect at all. It was at that point that he went to New York fir another opinion and then the Spurs seemed to get angry.

eh?

Let me put it to you this way

What is the point of passing a physical then?   Or a team wanting to check a player who just came off an injury before they dole out a big contract to sign them?

Why can't the player and agent just say, "don't worry about it,  our guys got checked it out, its all good"

If a player is injured,  the protocol is to see the team medical staff.  Then to get an assessment and "fix" the issue. So that the player can get back on the court healthy

In this situation it sounds like the Spurs medical staff gave their assessment, and wanted to help Leonard rehab/keep track of his progression or road bumps to ultimately have him comeback 100 percent

Instead, sounds like Leonard and his crew (at some point of the assessment) didn't like or was unsure about the Spurs medical staff assessment and went somewhere else and got a different answer.

If this is not undermining the teams medical staff, what is??   The team who is paying you millions of dollars should be in the front of the line to understand what is going on with your injury/health issues.   The Spurs organization at the moment from what it sounds like,  are in the dark with this 2nd opinion.     

Does this sit right with you??