Poll

Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?

I wish we had made another decision
14 (35%)
I am still happy with his signing
26 (65%)

Total Members Voted: 40

Author Topic: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?  (Read 15008 times)

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Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #105 on: May 16, 2019, 06:37:50 PM »

Online ozgod

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Do you have a link to Giannis' measurables being off the charts back in 2012? You've been here since 2007, do you have posts criticizing Danny for the wrong pick in 2012? I'm sure looking into your crystal ball here in the future it's easy to make that determination. A lot of teams passed on Giannis because at the time it was a big leap of faith. The very same people who are kicking Danny for not picking him would also be kicking him if Giannis didn't improve. I'm not defending the selection, but I can understand why it was made at the time. Olynyk was the safer bet, in hindsight it was the wrong bet. But hindsight makes geniuses out of some people like yourself and idiots out of others like Danny. How many others are idiots for not picking IT? 59 times he wasn't picked.

I care about your well-being - as I care about all the members of Celticsblog so I'm warning you...

Do NOT click on this link unless you want to be really REALLY sad.

I'm only posting this because you explicitly asked for it. https://youtu.be/Oaw0_zw9LGs

I re-linked it to the part of the video that Ainge probably focused on.

https://youtu.be/Oaw0_zw9LGs?t=503

At the time he was far from the sure thing that everyone with the benefit of hindsight seems to think he is. Certainly it was the wrong decision, but it's understandable why Danny made the decision he did and he hardly deserves to be crucified for it. It's not like he passed on a sure thing. He went safety first. The same way that people who passed on Giannis' siblings did. I went back through the forum to the time of the 2013 draft, I didn't see too many people killing Danny for passing on this guy. The same can be said of Kawhi, he went to No15 behind the likes of Fredette, Biyombo, the Morris twins and Derrick Williams who went No2.

Of course with the benefit of hindsight it was the wrong decision and everyone's looks like a genius for pointing it out. It's an easy decision to criticize. Being a historian is a good profession because you can point out everyone's mistakes.  :angel:

I will say one thing that Ainge and most of the GMs/scouts probably didn't take into account - Giannis's hunger to be the best version of himself. At the age that his peers were being spoiled playing in AAU teams and being chased by college recruiters, the guy was selling CDs and trinkets on the streets of Athens to help support his family. His drive to be the best was missed by many people.

« Last Edit: May 16, 2019, 07:45:42 PM by ozgod »
Any odd typos are because I suck at typing on an iPhone :D

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #106 on: May 16, 2019, 09:07:59 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Quote

Olynyk had decent bulk for a big, even if he wasn't strong, but had developed his skills and was playing at a high level in the NCAA.

Also, glaring athletic issues at times.
Hey, don't get me wrong. I hated the Olynyk picked and let that be quite known on this site for years. I got called out for that opinion quite a bit. I am not a fan of centers that can't rebound the ball. Olynyk was soft and horrible under the basket. He drove me nuts.

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #107 on: May 16, 2019, 09:16:59 PM »

Offline jambr380

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Quote
Being a historian is a good profession because you can point out everyone's mistakes.  :angel:

This is a good one oz - tp. I have a couple of friends who were history majors - hopefully I can remember to use this as a dig on their judgy personalities  :P

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #108 on: May 16, 2019, 10:23:08 PM »

Offline Bobshot

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No doubt Ainge wishes he hadn't signed him. But he had no crystal ball at the time indicating Tatum and Brown were coming, or that Hayward would miss a year with a serious injury, and then create chemistry problems on returning at less than 100%.

I think at this point he might be open to dealing him if he could, but if he has to trade Tatum and Brown for Davis, Hayward will pop right back into the picture, probably as a starter.

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #109 on: May 16, 2019, 10:34:00 PM »

Offline gpap

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Hindsight is always 20/20.

That said, it was the right decision. At the time of his signing, if I recall, he was ranked #20 in the NBA by ESPN (even higher than Kyrie at #25.)

Like someone else mentioned, Ainge didn't foresee Tatum making such a quick impact and Hayward getting seriously injured on his first night.

Believe me, I've been very frustrated with Hayward this year and feel he got a pass while many were so quick to jump on Kyrie.

That said, with another summer of training and working more on his game and less on rehab and hopefully with no logjam of small forwards, I expect and will be rooting for a much more improved Hayward next season.


Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #110 on: May 16, 2019, 11:17:57 PM »

Offline cltc5

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I loved the signing.  I think he'll be back.  He just needs to find his spot.  I believe with clearer defined roles on a team with less drama queens i.e. Rosier and the trades for ad removing Tatum, Gordon will find his place and you won't have to worry about seeing him drive so much

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #111 on: May 16, 2019, 11:41:43 PM »

Online ozgod

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Quote
Being a historian is a good profession because you can point out everyone's mistakes.  :angel:

This is a good one oz - tp. I have a couple of friends who were history majors - hopefully I can remember to use this as a dig on their judgy personalities  :P

 Back at ya! :laugh:
Any odd typos are because I suck at typing on an iPhone :D

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #112 on: May 16, 2019, 11:45:15 PM »

Offline SparzWizard

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Hindsight is always 20/20.

That said, it was the right decision. At the time of his signing, if I recall, he was ranked #20 in the NBA by ESPN (even higher than Kyrie at #25.)

Like someone else mentioned, Ainge didn't foresee Tatum making such a quick impact and Hayward getting seriously injured on his first night.

Believe me, I've been very frustrated with Hayward this year and feel he got a pass while many were so quick to jump on Kyrie.

That said, with another summer of training and working more on his game and less on rehab and hopefully with no logjam of small forwards, I expect and will be rooting for a much more improved Hayward next season.

Idk what Ainge was thinking rolling with three small-forwards in Brown, Tatum, and Hayward. It's too bad the 2017 draft wasn't that impressive. Fultz a bust. Ball look like he's about to get traded. Tatum having a bad second year.


#JTJB (Just Trade Jaylen Brown)
#JFJM (Just Fire Joe Mazzulla)

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #113 on: May 17, 2019, 12:25:46 AM »

Offline gpap

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Hindsight is always 20/20.

That said, it was the right decision. At the time of his signing, if I recall, he was ranked #20 in the NBA by ESPN (even higher than Kyrie at #25.)

Like someone else mentioned, Ainge didn't foresee Tatum making such a quick impact and Hayward getting seriously injured on his first night.

Believe me, I've been very frustrated with Hayward this year and feel he got a pass while many were so quick to jump on Kyrie.

That said, with another summer of training and working more on his game and less on rehab and hopefully with no logjam of small forwards, I expect and will be rooting for a much more improved Hayward next season.

Idk what Ainge was thinking rolling with three small-forwards in Brown, Tatum, and Hayward. It's too bad the 2017 draft wasn't that impressive. Fultz a bust. Ball look like he's about to get traded. Tatum having a bad second year.

I agree, we had small forward overload this past season. But, that could come in handy this summer pertaining to a trade.

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #114 on: May 17, 2019, 12:36:49 AM »

Offline satch

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in retrospect the last two free agents have not worked out. Miss watching last years playoff C's.

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #115 on: May 17, 2019, 01:28:32 AM »

Offline Triplenickle

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I always thought the point when hiring Brad was to grow with a young team, starting with the coach. So after getting better every season and slowly coming up in the league and seeing countless players overachieve for Brad, now when they finally look like their own "process" is about to payoff after 6 years or so...now they want to "win now" because the youngsters made them a contending team.

So being greedy, they want to get every free agent they can find to throw ahead of those guys while harping on their flaws and ignoring their strengths...then when those FA's show their own fatal flaws...attack the young guys for not being allstars off the bench without a ball in their hands because the point has some mental aversion to passing.

I've seen this before when Danny traded Perk when he saw with his own eyes what they looked like without him the final games in 2010. Alot of Garnetts effectiveness and even confidence came from Perk being beside him...just like Al needs that type of guy now.

And I seen it when he traded Antoine, then tried to make Paul the bad guy that year without realizing Paul was p---ed about the trade and wanted to leave because of it.  So all that gets left out and Paul is a lunatic taking his shirt off after a game, while demanding a trade.

I've seen all this bone-headed nonsense ever since Danny was hired, so you're gonna have to forgive me for thinking he's borderline incompetent as a GM...with one lucky year.

Sorry if that offends people...but frankly i'm tired of rooting for the self inflicted  ups and downs with Danny at the helm.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2019, 01:35:40 AM by Triplenickle »

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #116 on: May 17, 2019, 01:38:32 AM »

Offline SparzWizard

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I always thought the point when hiring Brad was to grow with a young team, starting with the coach. So after getting better every season and slowly coming up in the league and seeing countless players overachieve for Brad, now when they finally look like their own "process" is about to payoff after 6 years or so...now they want to "win now" because the youngsters made them a contending team.

So being greedy, they want to get every free agent they can find to throw ahead of those guys while harping on their flaws and ignoring their strengths...then when those FA's show their own fatal flaws...attack the young guys for not being allstars off the bench without a ball in their hands because the point has some mental aversion to passing.

I've seen this before when Danny traded Perk when he saw with his own eyes what they looked like without him the final games in 2010. Alot of Garnetts effectiveness and even confidence came from Perk being beside him...just like Al needs that type of guy now.

And I seen it when he traded Antoine, then tried to make Paul the bad guy that year without realizing Paul was p---ed about the trade and wanted to leave because of it.  So all that gets left out and Paul is a lunatic taking his shirt off after a game, while demanding a trade.

I've seen all this bone-headed nonsense ever since Danny was hired, so you're gonna have to forgive me for thinking he's borderline incompetent as a GM...with one lucky year.

Sorry if that offends people...but frankly i'm tired of rooting for the self inflicted  ups and downs with Danny at the helm.

One championship is great after 22 years, but man it's been 11 years it's time the Celtics grab one. Even the three other Boston sports teams have been reeling in finals appearances left and right. Ainge needs to make some serious moves or it's time for a new face for the franchise.


#JTJB (Just Trade Jaylen Brown)
#JFJM (Just Fire Joe Mazzulla)

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #117 on: May 17, 2019, 02:06:07 AM »

Offline Triplenickle

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I always thought the point when hiring Brad was to grow with a young team, starting with the coach. So after getting better every season and slowly coming up in the league and seeing countless players overachieve for Brad, now when they finally look like their own "process" is about to payoff after 6 years or so...now they want to "win now" because the youngsters made them a contending team.

So being greedy, they want to get every free agent they can find to throw ahead of those guys while harping on their flaws and ignoring their strengths...then when those FA's show their own fatal flaws...attack the young guys for not being allstars off the bench without a ball in their hands because the point has some mental aversion to passing.

I've seen this before when Danny traded Perk when he saw with his own eyes what they looked like without him the final games in 2010. Alot of Garnetts effectiveness and even confidence came from Perk being beside him...just like Al needs that type of guy now.

And I seen it when he traded Antoine, then tried to make Paul the bad guy that year without realizing Paul was p---ed about the trade and wanted to leave because of it.  So all that gets left out and Paul is a lunatic taking his shirt off after a game, while demanding a trade.

I've seen all this bone-headed nonsense ever since Danny was hired, so you're gonna have to forgive me for thinking he's borderline incompetent as a GM...with one lucky year.

Sorry if that offends people...but frankly i'm tired of rooting for the self inflicted  ups and downs with Danny at the helm.

One championship is great after 22 years, but man it's been 11 years it's time the Celtics grab one. Even the three other Boston sports teams have been reeling in finals appearances left and right. Ainge needs to make some serious moves or it's time for a new face for the franchise.

That's kinda my point...they could've had about 4 under Danny, but his decisions were lacking along with his failure to EVER get players to compliment his teams strenghts, always preferring to blow it up and go in a different direction because he doesn't have the patience to commit to his own plans.

This team is only one starting center away from everything having to go through them in the East.

I guess building up for years to throw it away on mismatched parts and misfits is the way to a ring...while you're getting beat by teams doing it the right way.

With GS being a dynasty at that.

I'm sorry man, i'm tired of Danny's leadership. He's basically just a busy-body that doesn't commit to his own vision.

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #118 on: May 17, 2019, 03:07:55 AM »

Offline Androslav

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Logical answer now would be no.
But at the time we signed the best FA on the market entering his prime years. Max deal was his deserved market price.
The fact that he broke his leg just 5 minutes in his 4 year max deal, doesn't change those facts for me.
We got really unlucky.

For the sake of argument, I'll just flip OP's question a bit.
Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Michael Jordan?
If we signed MJ entering his prime and he got injuried immediately, I wouldn't say that it was an ill concieved move.

Just tough luck.
That's what we got here.
"The joy of the balling under the rims."

Re: Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Hayward?
« Reply #119 on: May 17, 2019, 03:28:14 AM »

Offline SparzWizard

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Logical answer now would be no.
But at the time we signed the best FA on the market entering his prime years. Max deal was his deserved market price.
The fact that he broke his leg just 5 minutes in his 4 year max deal, doesn't change those facts for me.
We got really unlucky.

For the sake of argument, I'll just flip OP's question a bit.
Do You Wish We Had Never Signed Michael Jordan?
If we signed MJ entering his prime and he got injuried immediately, I wouldn't say that it was an ill concieved move.

Just tough luck.
That's what we got here.

Paul Millsap was also available for the max, but I think many here would go crazy if that happened and not in a good way.

I remember I spent the majority of my 4th of July refreshing Twitter/Celtics forum for the Gordon Hayward decision. Oh how much time has been wasted when you realized months later. The gruesome injury, and then the recovery year off the bench.

Next year is no excuse for Hayward.


#JTJB (Just Trade Jaylen Brown)
#JFJM (Just Fire Joe Mazzulla)